Wendell Hostetler Bonanza Build

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extra300s
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Re: Wendell Hostetler Bonanza Build

Unread postby extra300s » Fri Feb 24, 2017 10:19 am

well done!
Futaba!!!!
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Re: Wendell Hostetler Bonanza Build

Unread postby Tomcat1 » Fri Feb 24, 2017 10:34 am

extra300s wrote:well done!


Thanks bud, there's still a LOOOOONG way to go #-o
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Re: Wendell Hostetler Bonanza Build

Unread postby extra300s » Fri Feb 24, 2017 11:35 am

for sure, but just keeping at it as you doing will make short work out of this kit! Keen to see it progress. Keep em pics coming please.

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Re: Wendell Hostetler Bonanza Build

Unread postby Dbp7966 » Fri Feb 24, 2017 11:47 am

Hi,
Many thanks for the reply.

I found when I did the Hostetler 152 once the sides and stringers where installed she started to come to life and then gives you inspiration.

The range of suggested motors worried me to be honest 38-100 cc.
My 152 came in all up 32lbs as I did a scale cockpit and Nav lights and she flies great on a Satio fg57 petrol I would think that the Bonanza will have less drag so think the 55 will be ok.

Can I ask if you could measure the internal of the cowl at the front as this will help with motor selection. I like the DLE 60 flat twin as these are somewhat cheaper here in the `U.K.

What retracts are you fitting.
Well keep it up you are inspiring us.

Cheers
Wayne
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Re: Wendell Hostetler Bonanza Build

Unread postby Tomcat1 » Fri Feb 24, 2017 12:44 pm

Dbp7966 wrote:Hi,
Many thanks for the reply.

I found when I did the Hostetler 152 once the sides and stringers where installed she started to come to life and then gives you inspiration.

The range of suggested motors worried me to be honest 38-100 cc.
My 152 came in all up 32lbs as I did a scale cockpit and Nav lights and she flies great on a Satio fg57 petrol I would think that the Bonanza will have less drag so think the 55 will be ok.

Can I ask if you could measure the internal of the cowl at the front as this will help with motor selection. I like the DLE 60 flat twin as these are somewhat cheaper here in the `U.K.

What retracts are you fitting.
Well keep it up you are inspiring us.

Cheers
Wayne


Hi Wayne

DLE 60 flat twin sticks out the cowl on both sides, that's why my client has decided to go for the DLE 55. I will be fitting full cockpit on this one as well and I like the fact that it's a short kit...I get to select my balsa, and after having grown up on free flight...well, that says it all, so the 55 will be fine at the coast. Up where I am though, a 70 - 80cc would give a better scale performance.
Retracts are the scale set from Century Jet Models.
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Re: Wendell Hostetler Bonanza Build

Unread postby Tomcat1 » Fri Feb 24, 2017 10:59 pm

Hey Wayne, just a heads up, this birds plan is NOT accurate...seems laser is fine, all according to plan, but plan... [-( [-X [-( [-X
This is REALLY NOT what I would have expected from a Hostetler plan...just to fix current issue...about 30 + hours work...first off, extra 3mm sheeting...over and above the already 69 sheets :shock: #-o :roll: , stripping, aligning, tacking, measuring, plotting, drawing, cutting, sanding, fitting, sanding, checking, more sanding and finally gluing a CORRECT part #-o :roll: ](*,) :smt030 :smt104 :smt119

Watch this space... will explain tomorrow...my brain is fried for tonight #-o :roll: :?
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Re: Wendell Hostetler Bonanza Build

Unread postby Dbp7966 » Sat Feb 25, 2017 12:12 am

Hi
Not sure what to call you lol is it Tom!

Thanks for the heads up and am interested in where it is out.
I have located another build on RCUniverse so will check his out and ask. I can't remember seeing any issues.
Here are a few photos of his buil.
Many thanks
Wayne
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Re: Wendell Hostetler Bonanza Build

Unread postby Tomcat1 » Sat Feb 25, 2017 7:04 am

Seen the build Wayne, also not a very conclusive build thread. It started at a very late stage of the build somewhere in 2002 and stopped at this stage in 2004. He also resigned himself to the fact that he could not get a canopy, my client has contacted the firm making them and has been told he can order at any time at $145 including shipping. I suspect it is just the windshield and first side windows in one as the rest of the side windows are from .015 acetate sheet.

Sorry, it's Brendon, don't normally use my name on forum...silly really as quite a few people know who I am #-o :lol:
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Re: Wendell Hostetler Bonanza Build

Unread postby Tomcat1 » Sat Feb 25, 2017 8:04 am

Right, lets start with the easy part to sort out. First off there is an issue with the plans in that the top/bottom plan view does not match the cross sectional views. The cross braces were cut according to the plan view and matched the natural curve of the fuselage as seen in previous posts, however, here is what happens at F7.

F7 cross brace at plan view.
F7 cross brace plan view.jpg


F7 at cross sectional view
F7 cross brace cross section.jpg


This is a 5mm difference at half cross section so 10mm across fuselage #-o :shock:

Resulting deviation at F7
Resulting difference at F7C.jpg


Also the F7AAC is not supplied but cut according to cross sectional view is narrower at the bottom of fuselage than the F7B side former's.
Deviation at F7.jpg


Next is the cross section at F4 is actually ahead of F4 at the front dihedral brace, meaning the cross sectional view of the bottom former at F4 is wrong...worst off, it's not supplied so again out with the knife and balsa follow natural lines and cut one that fits #-o :roll:
F4 cross section actually ahead of F4 at Dihedral braces.jpg


Now these issues are easy fixes, the next one is where the big work comes in...all the former's between F1 and F3 are wrong #-o :roll: :?
The biggest issue here is at F2AAC. F2c was glued in place along with the side F2B's, then came F2AAC and then F3C. Once F3c was added the whole setup just looked wrong so I pulled out the trusty old rule and started checking my work.

F2AAC on plan view
Cross brace at F2AAC - Plan view.jpg


F2AAC according to plan view
Actual at F2AAC according to plan view.jpg


Actual F2AAC matches cross sectional view
F2AAC matching cross section.jpg


F2AAC on fuselage
F2AAC against fuselage bottom.jpg

F2AAC short.jpg


Ok, so you see the difference, so the cross brace was cut to match F2AAC and then F2AAC glued in place along with the side former's at this station. Then I glued F3C and it's side former's...now check the MAJOR deviation.
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Re: Wendell Hostetler Bonanza Build

Unread postby Tomcat1 » Sat Feb 25, 2017 8:21 am

Deviation at F2AAC (1).jpg

Deviation at F2AAC (2).jpg

Deviation at F2AAC (3).jpg

Deviation at F2AAC (4).jpg

Deviation at F2AAC (5).jpg


F2AAC is WAY out, which means the natural curve of the front end is lost as well as F2C and F3C also possibly being out (maybe). Check the dip at F2AAC.
Big dip created at F2AAC - fpollow inside line of strip (1).jpg

Big dip created at F2AAC - fpollow inside line of strip (2).jpg


Here is the fuselage with the cowl on, the cowl seems to follow the natural lines of the fuselage.
Cowl seems to follow natural line.jpg

Cowl seems to follow natural line (2).jpg


And the cowl at the bottom of F2C is acceptable to match up with F2C (it's flexible and hanging right now, that's why it's not against the bottom all the way)
Cowl fitting acceptable F2.jpg
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Re: Wendell Hostetler Bonanza Build

Unread postby Tomcat1 » Sat Feb 25, 2017 8:36 am

Too resolve this issue is not too difficult, it's just dam time consuming #-o :roll: :? There are two ways I could tackle it:
1: I could tack blue foam between the side and bottom former's, shape and the remove to get the correct cross sections of the former's
2: Strip 3mm balsa, lay the strips up from F1 to F3 then measure to the inside at all the former's and plot them out on paper, cut them out and sand and fit until they are correct
Either way is time consuming but in the end has to be done :roll: :?

Here's F10 with the stab supports glued in place. F10 only had a very slight deviation which sanded out very easily from both sides.
F10 only very slight deviation.jpg

F10 and tail mount sides.jpg


Well, I guess it's back to the building board to sort out this CR@P, till later okes :wink:
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Re: Wendell Hostetler Bonanza Build

Unread postby Dbp7966 » Sat Feb 25, 2017 9:59 am

Hi Brendon,
Many thanks for the very nice a detailed issues. Like you say can be fixed but time consuming plus you would have thought that both the plans and CNC cut parts would have been tested.

I have similar issues on my Cessna 152 build with items not matching up from item to plan so it seems to run in the plans/hardware.

Have you reported at all, I will if I do one buy from Belair here in the U.K. I am going to introduce him to your build so that he can ensure me mine will be ok.

Regarding the window sets which company produces those as if I do go for one will need some.

Will you be glossing this one?

Yes on the other build it was strange to see one quite so far into the build, I have asked on the build thread but no reply as yet.
I hope you don't mind me asking so much but I love these builds.

Keep up the very good detail as you are the lead for future builds.

What do you estimate the all up weight.

I have looked and I think I would go for the DLE 85cc as you say would give better scale performance.

So catch up soon
Kind Regards
Wayne
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Re: Wendell Hostetler Bonanza Build

Unread postby Tomcat1 » Sat Feb 25, 2017 10:16 am

Dbp7966 wrote:Hi Brendon,
Many thanks for the very nice a detailed issues. Like you say can be fixed but time consuming plus you would have thought that both the plans and CNC cut parts would have been tested.

I have similar issues on my Cessna 152 build with items not matching up from item to plan so it seems to run in the plans/hardware.

Have you reported at all, I will if I do one buy from Belair here in the U.K. I am going to introduce him to your build so that he can ensure me mine will be ok.

Regarding the window sets which company produces those as if I do go for one will need some.

Will you be glossing this one?

Yes on the other build it was strange to see one quite so far into the build, I have asked on the build thread but no reply as yet.
I hope you don't mind me asking so much but I love these builds.

Keep up the very good detail as you are the lead for future builds.

What do you estimate the all up weight.

I have looked and I think I would go for the DLE 85cc as you say would give better scale performance.

So catch up soon
Kind Regards
Wayne
From across the water


Waynen the supplier for the canopy you can find on the Hostetler site, it's only an email, but my client got a reply to confirm availability :wink:
The whole bird will be glassed and sprayed, covering on this one at this size is just a NO NO [-( [-X
At this point I'm not far enough into the build to estimate AUW and with the current issues, who knows what to expect in the future of the build and what other mods will have to be made #-o :roll: :-k
Cant remember where my client ordered his short kit from, there are a number of places abroad from me where they are available...only one CNC programmer is not the same as the next...wish my buddy would get a laser cutter as he is a CNC programmer and was a apprentice in the same era as I was...result, far superior workmanship and quality to today's standards :wink: 8) ...we measured ten times and cut once...I better start doing that with this build, which one would not expect to have to do from kit or laser cut short kit... I'm more a scratch builder so didn't realise how "out" these "Top Tech kits" can be #-o :roll: 8-[
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Re: Wendell Hostetler Bonanza Build

Unread postby Dbp7966 » Sat Feb 25, 2017 10:30 am

Hi Brendon,

Many thanks..
You are my inspiration so keep up the good work look forward to it.

Regards
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Re: Wendell Hostetler Bonanza Build

Unread postby Tomcat1 » Sat Feb 25, 2017 9:19 pm

Wayne, if you could link Bel-air Kits onto the build it would be GREAT...that's where this short kit comes from...only the kit is short #-o :roll:
all the spar box parts aren't there, the 3/8th ply joiner plugs are USELESS because someone CAN"T read a plan, the plan is inaccurate, the laser cutting of the spar box joints could be a lot better (glued with 1/2 hour epoxy and lifted from bench 2 hours later...F..K, fell apart...will have to join again tomorrow and glass both sides making sure joint is WELL soaked in resin...as for joiner plugs, they are cut at the join line at outer/inner panel #-o :roll: Wanted to look at the effect the root ribs would have on the issue posted earlier by installing joiner boxes and root ribs but aint happening because of missing parts, inner 3/8 ply spar box spacers also missing, fuselage plan shows no other ribs next to the "box" frame...wing plan says R2 is directly next to "box" side, there are two R2's, one is 1/8 ply and the other 1/8 balsa but they are not the same...still working through this thing racking my brain to see what else is a problem #-o :roll:
All this said, it's not a crappy build, it's just NOT for the faint at heart or inexperienced and is a LOT of work, but hey, if you love building like I do, it's WORTH IT :twisted: :mrgreen: 8)



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