The Flightradar 24 interesting traffic thread

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Re: The Flightradar 24 interesting traffic thread

Unread post by Bell 407 » Tue Feb 26, 2019 7:43 am

Yip, it was a rather nasty storm that came through ORT yesterday from about 16:00 onwards. Runway change to 21 resulted in some interesting "racecourse" patterns after aborted approaches to 03.

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Re: The Flightradar 24 interesting traffic thread

Unread post by Bell 407 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 8:17 am

Haven't seen SQ up at 43,000ft before. That's private jet territory :D

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Re: The Flightradar 24 interesting traffic thread

Unread post by Aquila » Tue Mar 05, 2019 5:02 pm

Bell 407 wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 8:17 am
Haven't seen SQ up at 43,000ft before. That's private jet territory :D

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A350-900’s can get to 43 000’ quite regulary when they are relatively light. The -1000 though is limited to 41 000’ so you won’t see them up there...
Raccoon jet driver...

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Re: The Flightradar 24 interesting traffic thread

Unread post by Hop Harrigan » Tue Mar 05, 2019 7:55 pm

If this has been discussed previously, please be so kind as to point me to the discussion, alternatively...

I used to be under the impression that FR24 used signals from airborne ADSB-Out transmitters received by private individuals who then pass them onto FR24’s servers. The data from these servers are what we see when we run the App.
However, I now find out that some of the GA aircraft in SA which appear on FR24 are not fitted with ADSB (specifically the newer Cirrus aircraft). So then:
1) How does this work ie how does a ground receiver figure out a lat/long from a Mode C or S transponder without an SSR Radar?
2) If it can do this, then why do not all transponder equipped aircraft show up on FR24?
Your enlightenment will be greatly appreciated!!
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Re: The Flightradar 24 interesting traffic thread

Unread post by jvdl » Tue Mar 05, 2019 8:37 pm

Hop Harrigan wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 7:55 pm
If this has been discussed previously, please be so kind as to point me to the discussion, alternatively...

I used to be under the impression that FR24 used signals from airborne ADSB-Out transmitters received by private individuals who then pass them onto FR24’s servers. The data from these servers are what we see when we run the App.
However, I now find out that some of the GA aircraft in SA which appear on FR24 are not fitted with ADSB (specifically the newer Cirrus aircraft). So then:
1) How does this work ie how does a ground receiver figure out a lat/long from a Mode C or S transponder without an SSR Radar?
2) If it can do this, then why do not all transponder equipped aircraft show up on FR24?
Your enlightenment will be greatly appreciated!!
Hop
Something I can actually answer!

1) Multilateration. In layman's terms, it kind of triangulates (although FR24 uses a minimum of 4 receivers, so it quadrilaterates, I guess?) based on the time it takes for the different receivers to receive the signal. See https://www.flightradar24.com/blog/how- ... with-mlat/.

2) FR24 hides some aircraft due to their sensitive nature, e.g. military aircraft, or because the owners have requested them not to display it (the Guptas' plane, ZS-OAK is a prime example). If that aircraft flies in range of your receiver, though, you'll still see it on your personal ADS-B receiver site. It's been argued that almost any idiot with a cheap receiver and a few pieces of wire can receive these signals, since they are not encrypted and there is little point to hiding the data. Sites like adsb-exchange.com (off the top of my head, might not be 100% accurate), do not hide any data and even allow you to query their vast database for free to a limited extent. For more in-depth access, you need to pay.
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Re: The Flightradar 24 interesting traffic thread

Unread post by Hop Harrigan » Tue Mar 05, 2019 8:48 pm

Hi jvdl,
Thanks...can you explain then why not ALL transponder equipped aircraft show up on FR24 using the triangulation technique...specifically mine, which isn’t Gupta owned?
Hop
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Re: The Flightradar 24 interesting traffic thread

Unread post by jvdl » Tue Mar 05, 2019 8:55 pm

Hop Harrigan wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 8:48 pm
Hi jvdl,
Thanks...can you explain then why not ALL transponder equipped aircraft show up on FR24 using the triangulation technique...specifically mine, which isn’t Gupta owned?
Hop
That's a good question, and I can only hazard a few guesses, nothing concrete.

1) Invalid transponder code programming or other issues with transponder.
2) Transponder not registered with FR24.
3) I don't know what areas you are flying in, but you may want to check the coverage map to ensure you are flying in an area covered by 4 or more receivers. The MLAT planes I usually see on my receiver are the large commercial jets which fly at very high altitudes and due to this are in line of sight of more receivers.

Try entering your transponder ICAO code or plane registration here, and see if there is any history of your flights: https://flight-data.adsbexchange.com/
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Re: The Flightradar 24 interesting traffic thread

Unread post by cage » Tue Mar 05, 2019 9:02 pm

Hop Harrigan wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 8:48 pm
Hi jvdl,
Thanks...can you explain then why not ALL transponder equipped aircraft show up on FR24 using the triangulation technique...specifically mine, which isn’t Gupta owned?
Hop
Any mode S with ES will appear (or ads-b).
Mode A or C will not appear.
Unless, like us, you notify them that you don't want to be displayed.
Triangulation only works with altitude since we have poor m-lat coverage.
Remain low and you won't be detected once outside urban areas.
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Re: The Flightradar 24 interesting traffic thread

Unread post by depach » Wed Mar 06, 2019 11:01 am

Another note with FR24 Mlat

On the build your own receivers - there needs to be at least one ADS-B aircraft in range of all the receivers that are participating in the triangulation in that area. The ADS-B aircraft supplies an accurate time clock for the network to perform the triangulation

In PE the map often springs to life with Mlat traffic when a ADS-B aircraft lands or takes off
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Re: The Flightradar 24 interesting traffic thread

Unread post by Zimfly » Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:05 am

Anyone have some info on why AF995 returned to JNB last night?
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Re: The Flightradar 24 interesting traffic thread

Unread post by Burner » Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:00 am

Zimfly wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:05 am
Anyone have some info on why AF995 returned to JNB last night?
Seems it turned around, after an hour on the ground then departed for Paris CDG. About to land now 4:15 late.
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Re: The Flightradar 24 interesting traffic thread

Unread post by Mars » Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:14 pm

Zimfly wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:05 am
Anyone have some info on why AF995 returned to JNB last night?
Medical issue.
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Re: The Flightradar 24 interesting traffic thread

Unread post by Glenn L » Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:17 pm

sometimes the skies above Iran look like a living aircraft museum.
I didnt realize there were 747-200's still flying. Plus there are a couple more old timers in this frame.
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Re: The Flightradar 24 interesting traffic thread

Unread post by evanb » Wed Mar 13, 2019 6:22 pm

Glenn L wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:17 pm
sometimes the skies above Iran look like a living aircraft museum.
I didnt realize there were 747-200's still flying. Plus there are a couple more old timers in this frame.
Wow! 4L-GEO is a 32 year old aircraft that started life with British Airways! Now with a Georgian airline!

Looking at some lists most -200s are either stored or scrapped. Some notable aircraft still in service include four US Air Force E-4B (aka Airborne Operations Center) and two US Air Force VC-25A (aka Air Force One)!
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Re: The Flightradar 24 interesting traffic thread

Unread post by Jasondn78 » Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:30 pm

This one is a 1978 year model. Is she still doing passenger service?
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