Service AI or fit Garmin G5

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Beech Bum
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Service AI or fit Garmin G5

Unread post by Beech Bum » Thu Nov 16, 2017 6:36 am

I need advice from anybody who has experienced the same conundrum. My AI is tilting in flight and have to be serviced - don't know what is wrong but suspect rotor replacement. It is vacuum driven without caging mechanism.
Do I buy the new certified G5 or repair the AI. My gut feel is that, even a repaired AI might go again in say 50-100hours. I am leaning towards the shiny new G5 - but the cost might be inhibitive. If you have done this, please share the experience and cost.
Another question is what can I expect to sell my existing AI for - unrepaired and repaired

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Re: Service AI or fit Garmin G5

Unread post by Beech Bum » Thu Nov 16, 2017 6:05 pm

I have just received a quote to replace the AI. The toal cost is approx R80k without VAT. Inclusive is the cost to get SACAA approval at approx R19k ex VAT. I now have heartburn and need a whiskey.
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Re: Service AI or fit Garmin G5

Unread post by Goldfinger » Thu Nov 16, 2017 6:22 pm

Hi Beech Bum

Your Quote was that to repair the Vacuum AI , I have / would recommend the Garmin G5 awesome piece of kit.

You should be able to have one installed / CAA paperwork etc All in for under R50K .

As for the old Vacuum pump gauges dont think you will get much for these


:D :D :D :D
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Re: Service AI or fit Garmin G5

Unread post by LowFlyingDuck » Thu Nov 16, 2017 6:27 pm

I’d suggest getting another quote before you do anything. I was recently quoted less than that for 2 x G5 units (the DI/AH combo) including STCs and installation.

In terms of the pricing comparison with repairing your old AH, I think it’s a bit of an apples-with pairs comparison. The G5 is pretty much an entire 6-pack replacement in one small instrument. Plus you get the benefits of redundancy, weight saving, etc. if you install a pair of them and dump all your vacuum systems. If you then couple it up to a Garmin GPS and autopilot, even better.
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Re: Service AI or fit Garmin G5

Unread post by Rotor kop » Thu Nov 16, 2017 6:49 pm

Beech Bum wrote:I have just received a quote to replace the AI. The toal cost is approx R80k without VAT. Inclusive is the cost to get SACAA approval at approx R19k ex VAT. I now have heartburn and need a whiskey.
:lol: :lol: :lol:
Did Whirly not have a well priced G5 here for sale recently?
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Re: Service AI or fit Garmin G5

Unread post by Lood » Thu Nov 16, 2017 9:58 pm

Was the R80k quote to repair your existing AI? If so, tell whoever it was that quoted you to get real and why would there be a CAA mod approval required for a repair on an installed instrument?

Go for the G5, regardless. I recently got a quote for two G5’s:
2 x G5: $4800
1 x magnetometer: $200
Installation: R25k
CAA fees: R21k
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Re: Service AI or fit Garmin G5

Unread post by Mauler » Thu Nov 16, 2017 10:40 pm

Crazy. The price of a certified G5 is around R30K. Uncertified is much less. You can get an overhauled Sigma-Tek AI from Aircraft Spruce for under R10K if you send your old one in as a core.

The unconscionable charges and skulduggery to get the paperwork to get a G5 into your panel is a big stumbling block. AOPA is getting plenty of reports about big money and long lead times for upgrading instruments and avionics. CAA just seems to be obstructive.

If anyone has experience installing a G5, please let us all hear about it.
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Re: Service AI or fit Garmin G5

Unread post by cage » Thu Nov 16, 2017 11:22 pm

Beech Bum wrote:I have just received a quote to replace the AI. The toal cost is approx R80k without VAT. Inclusive is the cost to get SACAA approval at approx R19k ex VAT. I now have heartburn and need a whiskey.
Get a new avionics company.
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Re: Service AI or fit Garmin G5

Unread post by Beech Bum » Fri Nov 17, 2017 6:22 am

I have yet to get a quote for repair of the AI, but the second quote came in at around R50K ex vat. Much better. I think Whirly had one for sale but unsure if it was a certified unit, will check.
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Re: Service AI or fit Garmin G5

Unread post by V5 - LEO » Fri Nov 17, 2017 6:58 am

....whirly had one, uncertified.
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Re: Service AI or fit Garmin G5

Unread post by TikkaT3 » Fri Nov 17, 2017 7:33 am

V5 - LEO wrote:....whirly had one, uncertified.
What's the crazy cost for "CAA Paperwork" then?

Isn't this for a mod approval?

If the certified unit can't be installed without paying the mod approval fees, why not then just buy an un-certified version and have the mod approved by the CAA? Like installing a Garmin GPS296 in your panel, you now need a mod approval done for that, that then becomes legal and it is not TSO... So why can't you install a experimental G5 in your type certified aircraft?
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Re: Service AI or fit Garmin G5

Unread post by cage » Fri Nov 17, 2017 7:59 am

TikkaT3 wrote:.. So why can't you install a experimental G5 in your type certified aircraft?
Because you need an STC for anything that goes into a certified aircraft.
There is a certified G5 and an uncertified one - the latter is far cheaper, almost half the cost.
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Re: Service AI or fit Garmin G5

Unread post by V5 - LEO » Fri Nov 17, 2017 8:11 am

cage wrote:There is a certified G5 and an uncertified one - the latter is far cheaper, almost half the cost.

....with exactly the same functions!
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Re: Service AI or fit Garmin G5

Unread post by Beech Bum » Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:15 am

I have heard that one can install a G5 additional to your primary instruments and get away with fitting the Experimental version by placarding the unit as " Not to be used as flight instrument" How true this is, I don't know - probably an urban legend
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Re: Service AI or fit Garmin G5

Unread post by TikkaT3 » Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:33 am

cage wrote:
TikkaT3 wrote:.. So why can't you install a experimental G5 in your type certified aircraft?
Because you need an STC for anything that goes into a certified aircraft.
There is a certified G5 and an uncertified one - the latter is far cheaper, almost half the cost.
A Garmin 296 doesn't have an STC as far as I'm aware and there are plenty of these panel mounted and wired-up in certified AC?

These required mod-approvals (and were approved) in the past, and all STC'd avionics could be merely installed with a 8130 and logbook entry?

Now the CAA, for all avionics (regardless of STC or not) require it to go through a mod approval process (because they've canned the STC equipment just needing a 8130 and logbook entry), so why not then just buy the experimental one and get them to approve it?

Summary: If you buy a STC avionics, you require a CAA mod approval. If you buy non-STC'd equipment, you require a CAA mod approval.
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