Ahrlac

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Peregrine
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Re: Ahrlac

Unread post by Peregrine » Thu Jun 07, 2018 11:28 am

StressMerchant wrote:
In fact if it is militarized in any way then the CAA will not touch it
Is that direct CAA policy, or aviation regs, or a consequence of other laws regulating arms trade?

The FAA and EASA certainly seem happy enough to certify the baseline of the aircraft, although there are limits to which they will extend. I don't think they would certify a weapon, or even a weapon release, but they would probably certify "safe carriage" in a dormant condition.
Civil Aviation Regulations, 2011

Application for registration of aircraft

47.02.1 (2) (e) in the case of an ex-military aircraft, confirmation issued by the South African National Conventional Arms Control Committee that the aircraft is not fitted with any armaments;


"Armaments" is not included in the definitions section of Civil Aviation Regulations, 2011.

New-built aircraft intended for military use are not contemplated in the CARs, so, together with the interpretation of "armaments", this is probably how the AHRLAC blokes have smoked their way to getting clearance to fly with underwing stores (if they have indeed done so). Are underwing hardpoints considered "armaments"? An example of "yes" is the SAAF PC 7 trainers, which could only be delivered without underwing hardpoints. Maybe AHRLAC has a special understanding with SACAA? Would be interesting to hear from ST Man regarding the foregoing.
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Re: Ahrlac

Unread post by Deanw » Thu Jun 07, 2018 12:14 pm

Peregrine wrote:Are underwing hardpoints considered "armaments"? An example of "yes" is the SAAF PC 7 trainers, which could only be delivered without underwing hardpoints.
Whilst it is most certainly true that the SAAF's PC-7 MKII were delivered without the capability to carry armaments under the wings, they can carry 155l fuel tanks attached to underwing plumbed hardpoints. Thus, I don't think hardpoints can be classified as 'armaments'?
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Re: Ahrlac

Unread post by Richard Smit » Thu Jun 07, 2018 12:41 pm

Just like the Safair Hercs, and various civilian PC-6 aircraft use external fuel tanks.

I don’t think a hardpoint should necessarily be seen as a weapons attachment point.
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Re: Ahrlac

Unread post by happyskipper » Thu Jun 07, 2018 1:12 pm

Richard Smit wrote:Just like the Safair Hercs, and various civilian PC-6 aircraft use external fuel tanks.

I don’t think a hardpoint should necessarily be seen as a weapons attachment point.
Exactly, Richard. Although the Safair L100 external fuel tanks are "permanent" in that they can be fitted or removed in a matter of an hour or two - but cannot be dropped or jettisoned - as in "Frantan".....
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Re: Ahrlac

Unread post by Whirly » Thu Jun 07, 2018 1:19 pm

When the ex military Gazelles started coming into SA the guys had a hard time getting the Arms Control Committee to understand that they had been demilitarised and it was a seriously frustrating process to eventually get that sorted. These people don't see nor understand reason like the rest of us and it took ages. :roll:

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Re: Ahrlac

Unread post by Peregrine » Thu Jun 07, 2018 1:56 pm

Deanw wrote:
Peregrine wrote:Are underwing hardpoints considered "armaments"? An example of "yes" is the SAAF PC 7 trainers, which could only be delivered without underwing hardpoints.
Whilst it is most certainly true that the SAAF's PC-7 MKII were delivered without the capability to carry armaments under the wings, they can carry 155l fuel tanks attached to underwing plumbed hardpoints. Thus, I don't think hardpoints can be classified as 'armaments'?
Agreed, but more than one per wing will be difficult to justify as not being intended for weapons, especially on AHRLAC, which is clearly designed for military use.
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Re: Ahrlac

Unread post by Peregrine » Fri Jun 08, 2018 3:20 pm

Whirly wrote:When the ex military Gazelles started coming into SA the guys had a hard time getting the Arms Control Committee to understand that they had been demilitarised and it was a seriously frustrating process to eventually get that sorted. These people don't see nor understand reason like the rest of us and it took ages. :roll:

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And to possibly explain why they were so sticky - the Gazelles were de-modified in the UK, but the structure for accepting the tubular weapons beam remained. So it was a simple matter to install a similar beam and sell some of the Gazelles onwards into African militaries as armament capable helicopters. That was not what the UK authorities and the SACAA wanted to happen. But in Africa......
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Re: Ahrlac

Unread post by Peregrine » Mon Sep 24, 2018 4:28 pm

13790017-06EC-47B2-9CDA-FFA4034EDC4E.jpeg
So, two hard-points per wing, ZU registered.
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Peregrine
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Re: Ahrlac

Unread post by Peregrine » Tue Feb 19, 2019 11:40 am

Just wondering........ what has become of AHRLAC? Where are the announcements of progress in their flight testing, marketing and sales? :?
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Re: Ahrlac

Unread post by Fransw » Tue Feb 19, 2019 2:11 pm

Peregrine wrote:
Tue Feb 19, 2019 11:40 am
Just wondering........ what has become of AHRLAC? Where are the announcements of progress in their flight testing, marketing and sales? :?
Perrigreen, why are you a Ahrlac hater? :?
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Re: Ahrlac

Unread post by Jack Welles » Tue Feb 19, 2019 2:21 pm

Peregrine wrote:
Tue Feb 19, 2019 11:40 am
Just wondering........ what has become of AHRLAC? Where are the announcements of progress in their flight testing, marketing and sales? :?
adc_ahrlac_osprey_2019_02.pdf
ahrlac_long_range_press_release.pdf
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Re: Ahrlac

Unread post by CA » Tue Feb 19, 2019 3:29 pm

They are not responding to phone and e-mails, and they are not paying there bills either, something fishy out there.....
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Re: Ahrlac

Unread post by micmaq » Tue Feb 19, 2019 4:02 pm

Is there a market for a COIN aircraft powered by a single PT 6A (750 hp) that can be flown as a piloted aircraft or at the flick of a switch converted to a drone with 28 hours endurance ?

Does it sound too good to be true but the technology has been developed by the South African company S-PLANE who call their creation a OPV (optionally piloted vehicle) and is on offer as a generic module to OEMs ; think of it as say a EFIS manufactured by Garmin, Dynon or MGL who offer their equipment for installation on various air frames from many different manufacturers

Just think that a pilot could fly the aircraft to say Cape Town, convert to unmanned and then fly to Marion Island unmanned + - 10 hours, patrol for 5 hours and return to Cape Town for a auto landing with real time processing to send data back to the base station - Search radar can be hooked into the Link-ZA tactical data link system to insure interoperability to the SANDF aircraft, ships and units on the ground

Dark ships (without AIS turned on) poaching fish in S Africa's EEZ can be pinpointed and intercepted and tracked to their next port for prosecution - The unmanned aircraft can take video and photographic evidence date/time stamped to help secure a conviction

Watch this space
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Re: Ahrlac

Unread post by Peregrine » Tue Feb 19, 2019 4:06 pm

Fransw wrote:
Tue Feb 19, 2019 2:11 pm
Peregrine wrote:
Tue Feb 19, 2019 11:40 am
Just wondering........ what has become of AHRLAC? Where are the announcements of progress in their flight testing, marketing and sales? :?
Perrigreen, why are you a Ahrlac hater? :?
I guess your remark was directed at Peregrine? As I said - “Just wondering”. Do you have any information you can share to make a meaningful contribution here? :roll:
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Re: Ahrlac

Unread post by Andrew Fletcher » Tue Feb 19, 2019 7:17 pm

AFAIK FAWB facility currently shut down, nobody working at premises . Whether temporary or not, no info.

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