samaa news poll

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when did your copy of SAMAA news arrive

1st week in december
1
6%
2nd week in december
5
28%
3rd week in december
5
28%
4th week in dedember
7
39%
 
Total votes: 18
Kid
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Re: samaa news poll

Unread post by Kid » Thu Mar 20, 2014 11:17 am

It sound like there are a lot of mis-management by the SAMAA committee. This cannot be allowed. If this situation is not rectified soon the committee and in particular the chairman can expect an official motion of distrust.
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Re: samaa news poll

Unread post by cabeng » Tue Mar 25, 2014 12:33 pm

Kid wrote:It sound like there are a lot of mis-management by the SAMAA committee. This cannot be allowed. If this situation is not rectified soon the committee and in particular the chairman can expect an official motion of distrust.
You prepared to stand inline and take over ?
Im just asking not passing judgement at all, but perhaps venting a bit , there are always guys that complain but never guys picking up speed getting ready to have the baton passed to them :?
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Re: samaa news poll

Unread post by Kid » Tue Mar 25, 2014 12:52 pm

cabeng wrote:
Kid wrote:It sound like there are a lot of mis-management by the SAMAA committee. This cannot be allowed. If this situation is not rectified soon the committee and in particular the chairman can expect an official motion of distrust.
You prepared to stand inline and take over ?
Im just asking not passing judgement at all, but perhaps venting a bit , there are always guys that complain but never guys picking up speed getting ready to have the baton passed to them :?



It is not a matter if I or anybody else is prepared to take over or not. That is a very poor excuse to let the association business go astray. Not everybody has the ability to take leadership but everybody has the right to vote and the right to voice his opinion should there be problems. Is this your way to say you don’t care and since you are not willing to take responsibility you will say nothing about the mis-management and furthermore if somebody else is not able or willing to take office he must just shut up and allow things to go wrong? If this is your attitude why do you even care to comment here?

People, get real. If there are 4000 members, all cannot be on the committee but all have the right to vote and the right to voice his opinion even if he did not vote.
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Re: samaa news poll

Unread post by SteveJay » Tue Mar 25, 2014 1:06 pm

Peter picked up the baton and did a great job for several years now - look at what's happening to him.
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Re: samaa news poll

Unread post by danie.e » Tue Mar 25, 2014 10:04 pm

One of the most stale and used up excuses for non performance by committee's is the lame line: " If you can do it better, attend meetings and make yourself available."

There is absolutely NO excuse for non performance if you made yourself available and actually fill a certain portfolio. You do not fill a position just because "no-one else" is prepared to do it. If one cannot do the job, dont take it. If there is no-one available to do the job then there is obviously no need for the organisation and just simply disband it.

So at the end of the day, if anyone has taken up the position, he/she must accept that there will always be those that point fingers when there is NON performance or mismanagement and cannot hide behind "if you can........."

If people accept the real responsibilities that go with the "job" they will do it well and there will be very little finger pointing and questions asked.

It is my humble opinion that SAMAA is not working for its membership in its present form anymore, and that a structure change is needed to play a more meaningful role for its members. I suspect that a more inclusive structure whereby all the clubs are drawn into its management via geographical representation may be a viable option to consider.
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Re: samaa news poll

Unread post by Mike Brews » Thu Mar 27, 2014 4:42 pm

Yesterday when I arrived at home, my wife, along with a nice cup of tea, laid a brown envelope down next to me. I instantly recognised that it was the SAMAA news letter. I tore open the envelope excited at what might be in this long awaited news letter. Oops the post office finally found my September/October issue.

There has to be a lesson here somewhere! :) :o :lol:
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Re: samaa news poll

Unread post by LionelBrink » Fri Mar 28, 2014 12:39 pm

Hi,

I am not sure how the individuals on this thread define "mismanagement", but permit me to provide the facts to allow each reader to draw their own conclusion.

SAMAA can only make qualified responses once the issues have been identified & the facts confirmed - hence the delay in responding to this thread. In essence, the SAMAA was tasked to reduce overall costs, whilst maintaining the printed format of the Newsletter. The SAMAA have subsequently revised the production approach to the Newsletter to achieve an approx. R120,000 annual reduction which puts the savings drive closer to the targeted 50% Nett cost reduction.

Every member on the SAMAA Management Committee is responsible for specific tasks, actions & portfolios. The Role of the SAMAA Chairperson is to ensure that each portfolio is managed appropriately, balancing between the resources available & Constitutional / AGM tasked delivery requirements. The Editor was responsible for a Newsletter to be produced according to the financial guidelines laid down in the budgets agreed at AGMs. The Newsletter income budget was relaxed for the 2013/2014 period to provide relief for this sub-task, but the Editor made it clear that costs could not be reduced further & as such the production of the Newsletter has been taken in-house, which has resulted in a delay to the first edition for 2014.

The Editor was notified in Oct 2013 that the financial forecast for the Newsletter indicated that the AGM cost budget would be significantly exceeded & a Nett loss would be recorded to SAMAA. To maintain sub-inflationary cost increases to members, SAMAA is a zero-gains organization, so it has very few options to accommodate cost overruns - especially given the strategic initiative of the past 2 years to reduce costs across all sections of SAMAA. A special meeting was held with the Editor in Nov 2013, where this forecast cost overrun was clearly outlined & specific actions agreed to ensure continued production for the Dec 2013 edition. The advert income was achieved & the expense invoice was eventually revised to the agreed budget by the printers (causing a further week long delay for print approval of the Dec 2013 edition), but it remained clear that the Jan/Feb 2014 edition could only increase the total Nett loss to SAMAA members. An investigation into the production of the Newsletter constituted the primary reason for the delay to the publication of the first edition for 2014 - as the financials used to assess the current state & forecast were first validated. The investigation report is being confirmed by the auditors - as yet, the auditors have not raised any issue regarding the Newsletter investigation report, nor have they raised any reason to doubt the SAMAA financials statements or financial controls used to substantiate the forecast used in the investigation. Following the investigation, this committee re-evaluated the production approach of the Newsletter, & more specifically actioned a reduction in costs by taking on this task in-house. A more detailed report of this decision is included in the 1st edition, March 2014.

I am happy to discuss aspects of perceived mis-management, but at this time the factual information provided to me by reputable sources suggests that the SMC is reasonably managed, and that when issues are identified, actions are undertaken to address these to the benefit/satisfaction of ALL members.

Regards,
Lionel Brink
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Re: samaa news poll

Unread post by Peter Joffe » Mon Mar 31, 2014 1:09 pm

In reply to the Chairman’s statement posted recently I have the following to say. First of all any businessman knows that cutting costs by reducing income is pure madness. I would like to suggest that the SMC halves the membership subscription from R345.00 to R175.00. We will therefore have, in round figures, 4,000 x R175.00 which is R700,000 to spend instead of R4,000.00 x R345.00 or R1,380,000.00 so SAMAA will have 'saved' R680,000.00. Wow this is advanced economics and needs to be mentioned to Pravhin Gordhan as a new way to save substantially on the SA budget. The fact that half in equals half out is clearly not understood by the SAMAA SMC. They halved the income from adverts to R100,000 from R200,000 and claim that they have saved R100,000. This is absolute lunacy. I have not responded until now as the Chairman undertook to reply to my questions but has failed to do so in more than a month.
Secondly the Chairman has told us, (with no notice to me by the way) that he has taken the Newsletter in-house, to save the costs that the SMC seeks. In the past there were no costs for the newsletter as production costs were covered by advert sales and I did all the work so how moving it in-house is going to save costs also defies common sense.
We now have a situation where we have, I presume our general manager doing the newsletter instead of attending to all of his duties as General Manager. He receives a salary of about R25,000 per month (including benefits) and if he has to sell adverts and get in editorial, as I used to do then he will take about three weeks to do the newsletter at a cost of about R18,000.00. Whose telephones and internet time does he use to do the newsletter or does he do it from home for free in which case advertisers do not work after hours so when will he talk to them?. So now on the next wonderful and intelligent costs saving exercise of the Chairman and the SMC, they have diverted a free newsletter to one that will cost at least R20,000 per issue more for the editior’s costs, and this does not include the printing and mailing.
In addition to the above we have the situation of R33,600 having gone missing in advert sales that I was accused (indirectly) of misrepresenting. The Chairman assured the members and the SMC that he personally checked the bank statements and that the sales never happened. Well I have proved convincingly that they did happen and that the monies were paid in to the SAMAA bank account but have since ‘disappeared”? Where is the money and why can we not get an answer on this question in five months of trying. I have proved that the money was in the bank but now it is GONE according to our Chairman who cannot understand a simple arithmetic question of how much is 24 divided by 2? He thinks it is still 24 fully supported by the SMC I might add.
I have gotten in to bad trouble for this before but here I am going to state it out in the open so that perhaps we will get a rational answer to the missing money and I ask the members for support in getting answers instead of red herrings.
Here are my questions A) Was the money stolen from SAMAA and if so by whom? B) Was it miss accounted for and if so by whom? C) Was it diverted to another project and if so by whom? I have asked the auditors to check this but have not had the courtesy of a reply. D) Did the Chairman lie about the missing money and is it after all in the bank and then if he did do this Why? E) Did Joffe cook the figures, well I have proved that I most certainly did not. I have the above allegations and only the SMC can answer them but for 5 months now they have refused in their attempt to cover up that should not be ignored. I got blasted before at the November SMC special 2013 for suggesting that there was criminality involved but as the questions remain unanswered the question remains – is there criminal activity in the SMC and if so by whom?
I ask the members under my lead to get the police or auditing ombudsman to find this money and prosecute those who have stolen it, if this proves to be the case, but at least get an answer from a free agent as to how this happened and why? The allegations have been made that I cooked the sales which have I have proven to be wrong.
This is a very serious issue and needs to be settled and now.
In summary we now have a newsletter which I have still to see, that is costing us more in internal costs. If the budget for advert sales is now returned to where it should be at R200,000 per annum then how will the newsletter recover its costs. These are, at this time, R8.00 for mailings and postages + R5.00 editors and communication costs + R5.00 printing costs, so we have a round total of R18.00 per member per issue less the cast in some budget of the Chairman and the SMC of R100,000 per annum which equates to R4,14 contribution to costs.
Where we once had a free newsletter, and total costs to members of R8.00, we are now looking at actual costs of R14,00 per member per issue. I am sure that all members will agree that this is a great saving and will bankrupt SAMAA very soon. And where is the missing money??
I call on a united front from members to demand the facts, call for a motion of no confidence in the present SMC and or call the cops to find out what has happened to the missing R33,600.00. This whole matter stinks and it is not a stink that has anything to do with the me, the previous editor.
It is time for members to demand the truth and censure the SMC or better still get rid of them all.
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Re: samaa news poll

Unread post by Peter Joffe » Tue Apr 01, 2014 11:00 am

Summary of Ist 5 SAMAA News issues 2013. By Peter Joffe Ex SAMAA NEWS Editor AS AT 2014/04/01
Mailed March April WT No. Total Invoice CP Inc Postages Postages Advert sales Nett Cost to members Cost per member Profit
3,722 8,972 R 65,313.87 R 14,888.00 R 38,100.00 R 27,213.87 R 7.31 R 0.69

3,900 May June 9,007 R 64,142.85 R 15,600.00 R 28,475.00 R 35,667.85 R 9.15 -R 1.15 Inc Extras for F3C

3,806 July August 9,021 R 65,469.35 R 15,224.00 R 32,950.00 R 32,519.35 R 8.54 -R 0.54 Inc Extras for F3C

3,778 Sept October 9,044 R 63,442.38 R 15,122.00 R 30,150.00 R 33,292.38 R 8.81 -R 0.81

3,784 Nov December 9,055 R 66,000.00 R 15,136.00 R 49,500.00 R 16,500.00 R 4.36 R 3.64

18,990 Jan Feb cancelled
Totals R 324,368.45 R 75,970.00 R 179,175.00 R 145,193.45 R 38.17 R 7.63

E&OE
The above is what has happend for the past 5 issues. Please note that the total budget has now been cut to R292,000 but worse than that the income budget has been cut to R100,000.00 and that is where the SAMAA SMC think that they are saving costs?? The above graphically illustrates how the newsletter is set for destruction with no benefits or savings for members if the policy to reduce income is supposed to reduce costs to the membership? THE BUDGET IS MADE UP OF 2 PARTS, R192,000 WHICH ALLOWS FOR THE MEMBERS CONTRIBUTION OF R8.00 PER MEMBER (4,000 Members) PER ISSUE TO COVER POSTAGES AND MAILING COSTS (THIS IS A FIXED COST THEY THEY HAVE ALWAYS HAD. R8.00 PER ISSUE IS ALL THAT MEMBERS HAVE TO PAY AS ADVERTISING SALES COVER PRINTING AND PRODUCTION COSTS. THE ABOVE IS THE ACTUAL AS THE EDITOR CHOSE IN HIS JUDGEMENT TO SELL AS MUCH ADVERTISING AS HE COULD AND THUS RECEIVED GOOD RESULTS, AND USED THE ADVERTS SALES INCOME TO PAY FOR THE PRINTING AND PRODUCTION COSTS. THE EDITOR NOW FACES THE WRATH OF THE SMC BECAUSE HE HAS PRODUCED A GOOD NEWSLETTER AND IGNORED THE INCOME BUDGET SET AT R100,000 WHICH CAN ONLY PAY FOR 12 PAGES OF WHICH 6 WILL STILL HAVE TO BE ADVERTS TO PAY FOR THE NEWSLETTER ITSELF. 6 PAGES OF NEWS? IS THAT A NEWSLETTER? Front page, back page of the committee etc, 1 page for the diary, 1 page for the Chairmans report and 1 page for the Genereal Managers report so that leaves 1 page for news and events?? Unless the SMC and the Chairman have a direct link to No. 1 they will not get a discount from the postal services and perhaps they could underpay some workers to do the hand work of inserting and sealing etc (the mailing component of the costs), and perhaps they could save a few cents by purchasing and printing cheap envelopes, but as can be seen the income is in the adverts and to 'save' on income is worse than brainless. Even if the postage and mailing costs could somehow be reduced to R7.00 it would not make much of a difference or saving to members.
If the SMC in their wisdom decide to exclude certain proved advert sales, there is very little I can do about that, but the above is the true and factual story. The main costs are in the prodction of the newsletter and they have been adequatly covered in adverts sales and the only way to reduce costs to memebrs is to increase advert sales which will mean, more pages and a greater contribution that can be taken from those advert sales and applied to the mailing costs that members have to carry. This has been my goal to reduce membership contrintuons by increasing sales, not decreasing sales as the SMC wants???
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Re: samaa news poll

Unread post by danie.e » Tue Apr 01, 2014 3:10 pm

SAMAA and PJ - An open request:

1) PJ - what was your actual cost per newsletter for the 6 issues in 2013? (calculated as follows: Total production cost per newsletter - this must include cost of envelopes and labour to fill them, postage cost, your profit margin etc.)
2) PJ how many issues were actually printed and how many posted?
3) SAMAA - what was the figure agreed between SAMAA and PJ per newsletter and was this per production run or per units posted?
4) Was ad income included in the negotiated figure between both parties?
4) SAMAA - was the above figure negotiated to cover all PJ's costs and profit margin and was there an escalation included due to inflation to ensure continued production?
5) Which entity was responsible for selling ad space in the newsletter?


The above questions need to be answered to give SAMAA members the required insight to make an informed decision regarding allegations flying around.

Danie Esterhuysen
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Re: samaa news poll

Unread post by danie.e » Thu Apr 03, 2014 9:58 pm

OK,

Peter has responded with some figures for the March/April issues through to the Nov/Dec issues - remeber that Jan/FEb issue was cancelled.

Total Issues POSTED = 18990
Total Invoiced to SAMAA = R324368.45
Total Ad Sales = R179175.00
Total cost of postage = R75970.00 (this was included in the invoice to SAMAA)

SAMAA agreed contribution towards each newsletter = R8.00 per member

The picture from Peter's figures as follows:

Total Invoiced less SAMAA actual agreed contribution (18990 x 8.00 = 151920.00) is: R324368.45 -R151368.45 = R173000.00 shortfall.

The shortfall was covered by Ad sales that seems to have been his responsibility . So Ad Income less Shortfall = Profit or loss to SAMAA members.

R179175.00 - R173000.00 = R6175.00 profit ( 6175.00/18990 = R0.32 per newsletter posted) (SAMAA agreed rate = R8.00) so R8.00 - R0.32 = R7.68 per newsletter

If we were to look at this cost excercise from a different angle, another picture emerges:

I do not think that Peter actually printed the exact number of 18990 copies and would rather believe that he may have printed a total of 20000 copies as there is always a production overrun. He has not given me any production overun figures so I will work on the number of copies actually posted.

If we look at the invoiced total of R324368.45 and we deduct the actual postage of R75175.00 we get R248398.45 which equates to R13.08 per newsletter in his pocket. This amount had to cover his production cost such as paper, labour, filling of envelopes, ink, and whatever else is required to put together the SAMAA newsletter. It must be remebered that his profit was also included in this figure. I am not a printer, know nothing of the printing business so I cannot comment on if this amount of R13.08 is excessive or not. (at 20000 copies it is R12.42)

As far As I am concerned the fact that SAMAA was in for a total of R8.00 per newsletter and the fact that it cost SAMAA actually less, it does not make sense why Peter has been put to task and "fired" for that matter.

Should SAMAA be able to give me irrefutable evidence that the figures given to me by Peter is false, then It will have to be treated as a case of fraud to be dealt with by the authorities. Alternatively, if on the other hand it can be proven that a cost of R13.08 per newsletter in full color is excessive and that Peter was making excess profit ( i.e. abusing his priveleged position as editor and owner of the printing business), then I will agree with the SMC on his removal as editor. In the absence of such evidence, I then submit that he be reinstated in his position.

Maybe there is someone among our mebership that can comment on costs in the printing industry.
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Re: samaa news poll

Unread post by tanglefoot » Fri Apr 04, 2014 9:13 pm

What if the distribution figures provided by the SMC are false. If there are not as many members as claimed then the cost to SAMAA would be much higher :?

What if SAMAA have incorrectly accounted for income received from ads? Where is the audit report that we were promised and what were the terms of the audit :?:

My personal preference is to believe PJ. The info received from SAMAA heas been less convincing.
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Re: samaa news poll

Unread post by clivem » Sun Apr 06, 2014 6:09 pm

+1

now that the SMC have produced the first issue it would be interesting to see the actual costs of producing that first edition in-house.
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Re: samaa news poll

Unread post by tanglefoot » Sun Apr 06, 2014 7:29 pm

clivem wrote:+1

now that the SMC have produced the first issue it would be interesting to see the actual costs of producing that first edition in-house.
Hopefully Lionel can provide audited figures of views of the electronic newsletter. Will be interesting to get a cost per view. Hopefully less than R8 per view.
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Re: samaa news poll

Unread post by danie.e » Sun Apr 06, 2014 8:41 pm

Thing is, its our cost not SAMAA. If you open it, Vodacom, MtN, Telkom etc start eating your bandwidth. Ever notice how the MB's disappear on your data bundle when you open and read e-books etc.?
So as for myself, the SAMAA newsletter does not exist anymore.
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