Extent of insurance cover.

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TrevorK
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Re: Certification ado

Unread post by TrevorK » Tue Sep 14, 2010 5:03 pm

<<moderated>>
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Re: Certification ado

Unread post by TrevorK » Tue Sep 14, 2010 11:25 pm

Now Skybound, that wasn't nice of you to remove my message from the forum.
Do you believe that Lionel’s response was adequate?
I think my understanding of Lionel’s reply to me was pretty much on the mark:
ICASA is unable to effectively address the toy airplane scenario.
SAMAA believes in complying with the ineffectively addressed ICASA regulations.
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Re: Extent of insurance cover.

Unread post by Dobo » Wed Sep 15, 2010 12:26 am

Although there are many frustrations wrt regulations in this hobby, mainly are there for safety purposes. Although we may vent our frustrations, we should be sensitive to the fact that the people we are criticising are, in fact, giving of there free time. Just like the committee of the clubs that we fly at, this is often a thankless task, and you field far more criticism, than praise. I have always advocated that if I find the performance of a committee unacceptable, I should be prepared to stand on that committee, or offer my time to assist them, before being openly critical of their performance.

I see this section of the forum as an opportunity to voice our concerns, and to understand how SAMAA are tackling some of them. The 2.4 gig issues are numerous, and will continue to be a challenge for some time. If we cannot change ICASA's view on the importation of 2.4 gig radio systems, by modelers themselves, we may need to look at alternate forms of insurance. Until then, many of us are flying, "insurance free", despite paying our Subs. This will either need to come from SAMAA or at club level.
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LionelBrink
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Re: Extent of insurance cover.

Unread post by LionelBrink » Wed Sep 15, 2010 7:54 am

Hi everyone,

As stated, SAMAA have been working with ICASA to clarify the 2.4 Ghz situation. The full copy of the SAMAA report is available on the SAMAA BLOG at http://samodelair.blogspot.com/2010/09/ ... stems.html. Very briefly, ICASA have finally recognised self importation of 2.4 Ghz RC sets & together with SARS acknoweldge that individuals who import less than 5 sets per year cannot be classifed as distributors & as such are exempt from obtaining Type Approval.

However, the onus rests on the user to ensure that the set complies with SA legislated specification (100 mWatt output as documented) & in the event of an accident claim, the user may be requested to provide proof of compliance. SAMAA will continue working with ICASA & the insurers wrt this matter to ensure that any updates on this are communicated to our members.

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Lionel
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Re: Extent of insurance cover.

Unread post by Dobo » Wed Sep 15, 2010 8:01 am

Lionel, that is awesome news. Thank you very much. =D> =D> =D> =D>

If you PM me your email address, I will forward you the mail I received from Futaba in the States, indicating that the sets sold in the USA transmit at 100 Mw.

Many Thanks

Paul
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Re: Extent of insurance cover.

Unread post by LionelBrink » Wed Sep 15, 2010 8:10 am

Dobo wrote:Lionel, that is awesome news. Thank you very much. =D> =D> =D> =D>

If you PM me your email address, I will forward you the mail I received from Futaba in the States, indicating that the sets sold in the USA transmit at 100 Mw.

Many Thanks

Paul

Hi Paul,

Much appreciated - I'll forward this to Allen Fraser who heads up the Technical Committee for attention.

Regards,
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Re: Extent of insurance cover.

Unread post by clivem » Wed Sep 15, 2010 8:11 am

Lionel

thank you for posting the link to the 2,4ghz issue =D> =D> =D>
I think this is great news! =D> =D> =D> and something that has taken some time to get sorted out - we can thank SAMAA for taking on this task and getting the results.

I agree - we must use this given opportunity to raise our concerns - not to condemn SAMAA and its volunteers. There are many things happening behind the scenes that we dont know about. One of SAMAA's weakspots has been the communication, of what they are doing, to its members. this is being addressed - even here on avcom we now have the oppurtunity to get open discussion going with Lionel / SAMAA.

Well done ALLEN =D> =D> =D> - I know he has been working on this issue for all of us! and probably others too - thanks to all of you
Last edited by clivem on Wed Sep 15, 2010 9:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Extent of insurance cover.

Unread post by TrevorK » Wed Sep 15, 2010 8:33 am

Well done SAMAA!
Thank you for your efforts in reaching this conclusion.
It is precisely what was required of the sport and I compliment you on this positive move.
TrevorK.
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Re: Extent of insurance cover.

Unread post by Dobo » Wed Sep 15, 2010 10:04 am

Dobo wrote:We, in SA, certainly have a unique situation. Equipment purchased from our local dealers is very expensive, and one purchased, we enjoy little or no support.
This has become plainly clear for me recently. I have a Spektrum 6250 receiver. It is specifically designed for use with Carbon Fiber aircraft. There has been a blanket recall on the product by Horizon Hobbies, and, in a bulletin, have urged people to stop using them immediately. A search in Google produced the same bulletin from the UK and Australian Importers, who have supplied a return and replacement process. In this country - Nothing. In fact, this receiver is still for sale on the importers website. Now, how would our SAMAA insurance respond to a claim when goods that have been recalled due to a technical defect have been used? I sent a message via our local importers website, 5 days ago, and have had no response.
Our local agents for Futaba and JK supply no product info or bulletins on their websites. (Futaba doesn’t even have a web site, and JR / Spectrum is a retail site) You therefore keep up to date on either the UK or American importer websites. On contacting Futaba in American, you receive a response that your email address is from outside of the USA, and you should contact your local agent - Sorry Mate, you won't get any help in SA. Fortunately, I was able to send another email stating that I have purchased my radio in the USA, and then I received the help, and response, I needed.

Now this, to me, is crucial in our Local vs overseas purchase decision. In most cased, the local importers also don't honor the warranties prescribed by the manufacturer. So, if I need support, I have to look overseas for it, however, I am expected to support the local importer, and pay a lot more. In this latest case, no action by the importers, could possibly lead to an accident, possibly harming someone. TrevorK is correct in his view that the ICASA need to re-look at their processes to suite the new Global market shopping trend. I also indicated the same thing.

So how do we put pressure on our local importers to provide, at least, the minimum support required???? SAMAA?????
Hey guys

I got a response from JK yesterday, wrt the AR 6250 receivers, to say that they expect the replacement receivers (AR 6255) in the next 2 to 3 weeks, and that we could either send the recievers directly to them, or return them to the shop that you purchased them from, who would initiate the replacement with JK.

That is awesome news.

Well done JK =D> =D> =D> =D>
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Chris
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Re: Extent of insurance cover.

Unread post by Chris » Wed Sep 15, 2010 10:38 am

TrevorK has been banned for breach of the rules - personal attacks in posts and pm's
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Re: Extent of insurance cover.

Unread post by LionelBrink » Wed Sep 15, 2010 3:01 pm

Chris wrote:TrevorK has been banned for breach of the rules - personal attacks in posts and pm's
Hi,

I am sorry to hear this, as I would like to have understood what the true concerns/issue were that TrevorK had once emotions had been set aside.

Unfortunately I responded rather emotionally to his initial "uncapable fools" posting, and as such feel that I am partially responsible for encouraging continued rants. However, neither SAMAA nor I wish to have any control/say over the manner in which this forum is moderated, this to ensure the necessary independance that all members of the forum have to raised concerns or suggestions to SAMAA.

I'd like to thank the forum & moderators for the opportunity to provide a communication channel between the Association & all individuals interested in aeromodelling within SA.

Thank you for your support,
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Re: Extent of insurance cover.

Unread post by Roger » Wed Sep 15, 2010 4:17 pm

More like Thank You Lionel for being prepared to take some of the rantings and respond to them in a public forum. This is where I believe avcom adds value to our community.
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Re: Extent of insurance cover.

Unread post by tanglefoot » Wed Sep 15, 2010 8:55 pm

Skybound wrote:More like Thank You Lionel for being prepared to take some of the rantings and respond to them in a public forum. This is where I believe avcom adds value to our community.
Yes, thanks Lionel for the continued feedback and interaction. Especially on the 'Ask SAMAA' thread it is essential to try to avoid emotive language.

We need to get to a point where ongoing actions, like Allen Frasers 2.4 negotiations, are common knowledge. It was extremely fortuitous for SAMAA that the results of (a lengthy) negotiation was concluded in the two days that Trevork joined Avcom.

Avcom is a tough pub. FIFO(Fit In or F&&k Off) is the order of the day, especially for (very) new guys. I think Trevork was just pleased to find an outlet for his frustration. I don't think he was being deliberately obtuse (online, in any event)

I think it would be a measure of success if this forum was to grow to the level of the CAA, SAWS, ATNS forums where there was less discussion and more Q&A.
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Re: Extent of insurance cover.

Unread post by cabeng » Wed Dec 22, 2010 6:24 pm

HI,
This could be completely the wrong place to ask, but is related to insurance cover
I have been flying Model aircraft since 1987, flew "Hot Quicky " regularly and a few f1 races ( Achieved a 2nd in one of the nationals, Around 1991 I think ) and a little bit of pattern , also flew for the SANDF in the " Skylift" program I have also trained many students to be successfully solo. I basically gave up for a few years, around 1996 and am now getting back into it ( About to join a club and SAMAA again)
My Question is would a " Old timers " clause come into effect or do I still need to drive 200km to regain a solo rating ? ( for me it was like riding a biycicle, after one 10 min flight was doing low passes and crosswind landings better that some other "solo" member at the club)
I have also picked up on flying helicopters ( did for a short while before I left years ago) again, with no instructor or even solo heli pilot in our club I have learned to fly with fair confidence, doing circuits ect. Would I not be covered in the event of an incident , What does SAMAA recommended in this case?

Regards
Alex
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Re: Extent of insurance cover.

Unread post by LionelBrink » Wed Dec 29, 2010 8:38 am

Hi Alex,

Welcome back!

The "grandfather" clause for SOLO application is evaluated on a case-by-case basis now. Please forward your details to Bob Skinner (mailto:samaa-admin@mweb.co.za)at the SAMAA office for review & application.

Regards,
Lionel
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