Hunting Destinations

Information regarding aviation friendly destinations and airfields.

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Re: Hunting Destinations

Unread post by Induna » Wed May 10, 2017 1:34 pm

Winchman,

the picture of you at the Oryx has been done properly, well done! As a registered Dedicated Hunter and Sport Shooter one of the things that we have been taught is how to hunt in ethical ways as well as showing respect for the animal you just shot.

One of the ways of showing respect for the animal is to present it in a honorable and ethical way before you snap a picture. You tuck its paws neatly under him, clear all areas where animal blood may be seem on the picture, etc. This was done properly and as you can see, it just look right...

Fly (and hunt) safe!!

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Re: Hunting Destinations

Unread post by TikkaT3 » Wed May 10, 2017 1:36 pm

Nice pics Winchman.. You have the right attitude and most hunters share that attitude, unfortunately there are indeed some who taint hunting and you're correct in calling those who do that "shooting" not hunting. That Gemsbok sure has tasty meat, I live on game meat. I can't recall when last I've bought a steak from the Spar, my deep-freeze is full of lean game and myself and the missus both enjoy it. I sometimes do crave a skaap-choppie and that's about all that I buy.

Don't worry about the vegan "higher than thou" attitude and playing the man not the ball, that's just how it is, you can be objective and let them live as they do but they are prejudice to everyone who eats meat. Apollo has probably only told 10 people that he's vegan today and needs to hit his goal of telling 15 a day.
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Re: Hunting Destinations

Unread post by Winchman » Wed May 10, 2017 1:39 pm

Thanks Jaques and Tikka

Never been particularly fond of lentils myself and hemp is scratchy :roll:
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Re: Hunting Destinations

Unread post by apollo11 » Wed May 10, 2017 1:41 pm

A nerve yes, I once saw an animal shot by a couple hunters that suffered horribly, and they thought it terribly funny.
Over the years saw some other totally unnecessary killing.

Look if you need to hunt for pure survival in a very far away from civilization location I get that, but modern apparent civilized people living in modern cities?

Those stunning pics minus the poser next to the dead animal, imagine how more fantastic if the animal still lived. Why the heck just not have shot the animal with more great photo's?

We are all different on our moral ground and respect for non human life.

Logic for killing is when your life is gravely threatened, no more no less.

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Re: Hunting Destinations

Unread post by Winchman » Wed May 10, 2017 1:57 pm

apollo11 wrote:A nerve yes, I once saw an animal shot by a couple hunters that suffered horribly, and they thought it terribly funny.
Over the years saw some other totally unnecessary killing.

Look if you need to hunt for pure survival in a very far away from civilization location I get that, but modern apparent civilized people living in modern cities?

Those stunning pics minus the poser next to the dead animal, imagine how more fantastic if the animal still lived. Why the heck just not have shot the animal with more great photo's?

We are all different on our moral ground and respect for non human life.

Logic for killing is when your life is gravely threatened, no more no less.

Back to aviation for me
Apollo you threw the stones not us. I gave you the opportunity to engage maturely. I respect your feelings over the animal that was badly killed and the flippancy of those that laughed at it. I deplore that as much as you do. I made that clear in my statement. Ethical hunting, and in fact the ethical consumption of any animal product not only food, has to be based first and foremost on respect.

Civilisation is not necessarily depicted by cities and the like as you say, since that is a fundamental part of our problem. Cities foster and encourage wholesale consumerism which is vastly more damaging to the environment as a whole, and is by far and away responsible for far more animal suffering than hunting.

We are created as meat eaters. it is a fundamental part of our makeup, physiology and psychology. It is not a habit or a luxury but is integral with being human. We are omnivores. If you choose to not eat meat, that is absolutely fine by me and I do not condemn or criticise regardless of the reason, however I am sure that you supplement your diet with other forms of protein? Often dressed up to look like meat? soya mince as an example. I have seen and eaten with vegan friends, soya mince, soya patties, soya sausage and soya prawns. Now if we were not meant to eat meat, why would we need that? And why make it pretend to be meat? He used to sneak out over to my place from time to time for a protein shot and braai an ostrich steak with me. :lol: His wife became quite ill over time by the way and when she was properly assessed, the doctor told her to get red meat back into her diet and she came right very quickly.

Condemning all hunting really achieves nothing. But, supporting and promoting ethical and sustainable hunting has massive benefits for the environment as a whole, and increases the pressure on the unethical.

I think we are coming from the same place, just our personal perspectives are different and that what makes life so diverse and fun dont you think?
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Re: Hunting Destinations

Unread post by ehs » Wed May 10, 2017 2:04 pm

Rooster wrote:
coline wrote:Why pick on poor innocent animals - go for politicians!
Nobody wants to mount a politician!!
Hmmmm! What about Jacob and Dlamini-Zuma ...
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Re: Hunting Destinations

Unread post by E816 » Wed May 10, 2017 2:09 pm

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Re: Hunting Destinations

Unread post by ehs » Wed May 10, 2017 2:20 pm

Take the hunting is right/wrong question out of it (it's an ideological argument, so no winners there) and you're left with a simple financial fact. Man does not preserve that which is expensive to keep but which has no commercial value.

Why do you think there's so many sheep in the world?
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Re: Hunting Destinations

Unread post by Winchman » Wed May 10, 2017 2:36 pm

ehs wrote:Take the hunting is right/wrong question out of it (it's an ideological argument, so no winners there) and you're left with a simple financial fact. Man does not preserve that which is expensive to keep but which has no commercial value.

Why do you think there's so many sheep in the world?
Eddie I both agree and disagree with you. Certainly cost and profit is a big driver, but if you look at genuine conservation initatives, they do exist and are both morally sound and some times successful without a financial benefit.

As for the sheep, you are quite right and that supports my criticism of the consumer model. If there were more ethical hunters maybe we would need less sheep? With better diversity and less negative environmental impact of large herds of grazers
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Re: Hunting Destinations

Unread post by TikkaT3 » Wed May 10, 2017 2:58 pm

Winchman wrote:
ehs wrote:
As for the sheep, you are quite right and that supports my criticism of the consumer model. If there were more ethical hunters maybe we would need less sheep? With better diversity and less negative environmental impact of large herds of grazers
Another point on the sheep. In the Karoo one used to get massive herds of Springbok that roamed the area (not too long ago, less than 10 years ago). These days they are few and far between. I was discussing this with a Karoo sheep farmer a while ago. He said why must he go to all the hassle of getting groups of hunters in to hunt Springbok at R350 each when he can get R800 for a sheep at the market for virtually no effort?

The Springbok compete with the sheep for grazing so the Springbok no longer exist on that farm.

That's how hunting ensures the existence of the species.

On the flip side, for farmers that do decide to farm with game in the Karoo, they're now charging R1200 for a Springbok so that they can stay afloat. This is very expensive and as with aviation, hunting prices are becoming out of reach of the average Joe Soap. When the point comes when the hunters can't afford those prices, the farmer will remove the Springbok and farm with sheep.
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Re: Hunting Destinations

Unread post by Fransw » Wed May 10, 2017 3:33 pm

Induna wrote:Winchman,

the picture of you at the Oryx has been done properly, well done! As a registered Dedicated Hunter and Sport Shooter one of the things that we have been taught is how to hunt in ethical ways as well as showing respect for the animal you just shot.

One of the ways of showing respect for the animal is to present it in a honorable and ethical way before you snap a picture. You tuck its paws neatly under him, clear all areas where animal blood may be seem on the picture, etc. This was done properly and as you can see, it just look right...

Fly (and hunt) safe!!

Jacques
If you look at some YouTube clips on hunting I understand why many people hate hunters! A lot of them are not ethical hunters and are a disgrace! Its good to hear the non hunting guy's opinion and concern.

Im also hunt and registered Dedicated Hunter and Sport shooter..
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Re: Hunting Destinations

Unread post by Winchman » Wed May 10, 2017 3:49 pm

TikkaT3 wrote:
Winchman wrote:
ehs wrote:
As for the sheep, you are quite right and that supports my criticism of the consumer model. If there were more ethical hunters maybe we would need less sheep? With better diversity and less negative environmental impact of large herds of grazers
Another point on the sheep. In the Karoo one used to get massive herds of Springbok that roamed the area (not too long ago, less than 10 years ago). These days they are few and far between. I was discussing this with a Karoo sheep farmer a while ago. He said why must he go to all the hassle of getting groups of hunters in to hunt Springbok at R350 each when he can get R800 for a sheep at the market for virtually no effort?

The Springbok compete with the sheep for grazing so the Springbok no longer exist on that farm.

That's how hunting ensures the existence of the species.

On the flip side, for farmers that do decide to farm with game in the Karoo, they're now charging R1200 for a Springbok so that they can stay afloat. This is very expensive and as with aviation, hunting prices are becoming out of reach of the average Joe Soap. When the point comes when the hunters can't afford those prices, the farmer will remove the Springbok and farm with sheep.
Agreed Tikka

Its all about economics at the end of the day however, at the upper end of the hunting sector, the prices realised for bigger animals whether purely for the table or as trophy animals starts the swing in the other direction. The breeding of unique strains and unusual colourations that have become incredibly sought after has also made game farming more lucrative and a real prospect as opposed to cattle or sheep in some areas, however I think that sheep farming is with us to stay because of the demand and return for the farmer which one can understand. All that said, I am not in favour of the very scientific selective breeding for unnatural strains and I believe that bubble will also burst at some stage.
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Re: Hunting Destinations

Unread post by Eddie » Wed May 10, 2017 3:55 pm

Whirly wrote:
Eddie wrote:Have a look at Zuikerkop lodge. Hanger going up this week. http://www.zuikerkop.co.za
Hangar for visiting aircraft/helicopters? :?

Whirly.
Hi Whirly

Mostly for my RV, but with lots of extra space for visiting aircraft/helicopters as well.
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Re: Hunting Destinations

Unread post by Lood » Wed May 10, 2017 4:43 pm

So, I farm with sheep and cattle, but I also have Springbuck and Gemsbuck. Every part of farmland, anywhere in the world has something called "carrying capacity ". If you exceed this, you're farming on borrowed time and you won't last. You simply can't stock more animals than what your land can carry.

We haven't hunted much in last 5 odd years and now the game figures are getting out of hand. So, other than hunting them, how else am I, and all other farmers for that matter, supposed to control the game :?: Believe it or not, but we also have bills to pay, kids who go to school and university, term loan payments, vehicle payments, you name it. We don't get a fixed monthly salary and regardless of what we produce, we don't have a say in determining the price we get for our produce. We have to take what we are offered, be it good or bad. And sadly, the latter is relevant, mostly.

Each year, all our lambs and calces are sold to feedlots and abattoirs and they're all killed and in the end consumed by humans. Equally, the game "use" a certain portion of my farm, so the game will be responsible for a certain portion of my income.

I agree 100% that unethical hunting is a big BO, but like in all other walks of life, big no's don't necessarily count for everyone. There will always be those who do whatever they like and so it will be with hunting.
If unethical hunters boils your blood, don't ever be present where excess game are being culled chopper ...

And that, gents, is reality ...
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Re: Hunting Destinations

Unread post by Winchman » Wed May 10, 2017 5:11 pm

Lood wrote:So, I farm with sheep and cattle, but I also have Springbuck and Gemsbuck. Every part of farmland, anywhere in the world has something called "carrying capacity ". If you exceed this, you're farming on borrowed time and you won't last. You simply can't stock more animals than what your land can carry.

We haven't hunted much in last 5 odd years and now the game figures are getting out of hand. So, other than hunting them, how else am I, and all other farmers for that matter, supposed to control the game :?: Believe it or not, but we also have bills to pay, kids who go to school and university, term loan payments, vehicle payments, you name it. We don't get a fixed monthly salary and regardless of what we produce, we don't have a say in determining the price we get for our produce. We have to take what we are offered, be it good or bad. And sadly, the latter is relevant, mostly.

Each year, all our lambs and calces are sold to feedlots and abattoirs and they're all killed and in the end consumed by humans. Equally, the game "use" a certain portion of my farm, so the game will be responsible for a certain portion of my income.

I agree 100% that unethical hunting is a big BO, but like in all other walks of life, big no's don't necessarily count for everyone. There will always be those who do whatever they like and so it will be with hunting.
If unethical hunters boils your blood, don't ever be present where excess game are being culled chopper ...

And that, gents, is reality ...
Hey Lood

Where do you farm? A gathering of aviation minded ethical hunters to contribute to your financial viability could be fun :)
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