Drone flying on your own Farm?

Unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV), commonly known as a drone and also referred to as an unpiloted aerial vehicle and a remotely piloted aircraft (RPA) by the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO), is an aircraft without a human pilot aboard.

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Wonko the Sane
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Re: Drone flying on your own Farm?

Unread post by Wonko the Sane » Mon Oct 01, 2018 12:21 pm

FDB wrote:
Mon Oct 01, 2018 12:03 pm
Hi Wonko.
Do those things not apply to the pilots rather than the venue that allows people to fly their drones there?
Hi FDB

Please note that I am not involved with or associated with, any law making authority or regulatory body. These are my personal views, backed by the info that is available.

My interests in RPAS were also purely for recreational purposes and like you the idea was to do aerial photography. No buildings or structures, purely wildlife...

The minute any form of income is generated by any form of RPAS use...the rules change.

If you are going to photograph your own game on your own farm with your own equipment and you are not going to sell the photos and you are not overstepping any other regulations, then no-one can stop you and I will be one of those joining you.

I am just participating on RPAS related issues here on Avcom to spread awareness of the consequences of people's actions. I would hate to hear that you or any other person was "made an example of" as so many on here would like to see happen, just because you wanted to use your toys for your own fun, but overstepped some stupid rule or managed to p i ss off the wrong person...

Good luck with your venture.

Andre
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My flying is not that bad....I've never left one up there..

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Re: Drone flying on your own Farm?

Unread post by Wonko the Sane » Mon Oct 01, 2018 12:28 pm

cage wrote:
Mon Oct 01, 2018 12:14 pm
Wonko the Sane wrote:
Mon Oct 01, 2018 12:07 pm
cage wrote:
Mon Oct 01, 2018 11:59 am


Isn't the height restriction 150ft but permitted up to 450 if at a registered SAMAA field?
400ft irrespective of location (many other and/or also to be noted)

W
What people don't understand is that 400ft puts you properly in helicopter country in many areas.
correct cage, but not my rule...

This is where training and self-discipline comes into the equation. Ask any toyshop drone purchaser at what level a helicopter flies, and he will 9/10 give you a blinking stare.... Once you become "licenced" it doesn't mean you will automatically stay out of trouble, but you will be aware of other airspace users... Believe me, I don't want your expensive toy breaking my expensive toy and giving us both something to whine about on Avcom... :twisted: :twisted: :lol: :lol:


W
I don't care what you think of me! Unless you think I'm awesome - then you're right, carry on!

My flying is not that bad....I've never left one up there..

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Re: Drone flying on your own Farm?

Unread post by FDB » Mon Oct 01, 2018 12:47 pm

Thanx Wonko.
Agreed.
Our thought was to set up numbered Drone Stations every 1km along one of the paths.
People can then go to their station, set up, and fly in their 500M radius, at lets say a limit of 50M to 70M high.
All other laws and regulations they need to follow applies.

This way at least, people have a place they can go to and practice their hobby in peace. No-one would walk up to them and give them grief. We would also know if anyone is a cowboy and easily ban them from the venue.

But it is tough to get all the info needed to decide whether this is something we should look at allowing or just keep it private for us and a few close friends.
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Re: Drone flying on your own Farm?

Unread post by V5 - LEO » Mon Oct 01, 2018 1:05 pm

...do-able if you go that way FDB, just get rid of the cowboys asap, but expect them to go behind your back and say you run an illegal op out on your farm and then the fun police arrive. #-o Sounds like immense fun and if all goes smooth should be nice to have such a venue.
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Re: Drone flying on your own Farm?

Unread post by Wonko the Sane » Mon Oct 01, 2018 1:09 pm



W
I don't care what you think of me! Unless you think I'm awesome - then you're right, carry on!

My flying is not that bad....I've never left one up there..

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Re: Drone flying on your own Farm?

Unread post by edwoodza » Mon Oct 01, 2018 1:38 pm

One note: using it on your own farm unless you taking selfies CAA will view it as commercial since you using for your farms "gain" and in 101 they have a ROC option for company registered ROC for company use not external use which further clarifies this.

And correct. SAMAA rules apply to hobby flying. Ie go to SAMAA field and fly your drone its ok.
BUT go to SAMAA filed and fly your drone and sell pictures or use for gain, 101 applies as that's outside scope of SAMAA

the 10km exclusion applies to airfields, strips, helipads (and not just registered) CAA view it as anywhere an aircraft regularity can take off and land. So yes registered but also unregistered apply. Because at the end of the day lake off and landing phase of aircraft flight is where most accidents happen hence why the 10km law was applied to remove low flying drones from being near low flying aircraft..

101 sux, but does make sense in the bigger picture of things. but it still sux
..
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Re: Drone flying on your own Farm?

Unread post by edwoodza » Mon Oct 01, 2018 1:39 pm

FDB wrote:
Mon Oct 01, 2018 12:47 pm
Thanx Wonko.
Agreed.
Our thought was to set up numbered Drone Stations every 1km along one of the paths.
People can then go to their station, set up, and fly in their 500M radius, at lets say a limit of 50M to 70M high.
All other laws and regulations they need to follow applies.

This way at least, people have a place they can go to and practice their hobby in peace. No-one would walk up to them and give them grief. We would also know if anyone is a cowboy and easily ban them from the venue.

But it is tough to get all the info needed to decide whether this is something we should look at allowing or just keep it private for us and a few close friends.

500m yes and NO, 101 states you need to have a fire extinguisher and 1st air kit within 300m on take off and landing zone. so keep that in mind to be legal. 500m is actually 300m really
..
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Re: Drone flying on your own Farm?

Unread post by heisan » Mon Oct 01, 2018 3:27 pm

General restrictions
101.05.10 (3) Except by the holder of an ROC, and as approved by the Director, no RPA shall be operated—
(b) within a radius of 10km from an aerodrome:
“aerodrome” means an aerodrome as defined in the Act, and for the purposes of these regulations includes a heliport;
“aerodrome” means any demarcated area on land or water or any building which is used or intended to be used, either wholly or in part, for the arrival or departure of an aircraft, and includes any building, installation or equipment within such area which is used or intended to be used in connection with the arrival, departure or movement of an aircraft;
Nothing says it must be a licensed aerodrome...
cage wrote:
Mon Oct 01, 2018 12:14 pm
What people don't understand is that 400ft puts you properly in helicopter country in many areas.
All designated SAMAA sites are listed in the AIPs, and as such, it is the pilot's responsibility to know about these sites and avoid them. (NOTE: Not very practical, as it is a huge list, only really identifiable by GPS coordinates.)
edwoodza wrote:
Mon Oct 01, 2018 1:38 pm
One note: using it on your own farm unless you taking selfies CAA will view it as commercial since you using for your farms "gain" and in 101 they have a ROC option for company registered ROC for company use not external use which further clarifies this.
Not 'commercial' as such, but 'corportate' in the regulations. Unfortunately, whoever compiled the final gazette left out the modified definition of 'corporate operations' for RPAS, so as the law stands, this only applies to passenger operations with RPAS, which are in themselves illegal.

'Corporate operations' cannot exist with the regulations as they are currently published.
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Re: Drone flying on your own Farm?

Unread post by FDB » Mon Oct 01, 2018 3:42 pm

How are people supposed to know where all the private microlight strips are?
And how does SAMAA apply to a guy who just bought a DJI Mavic for his son to use on their farm?

Also.
If a private microlight strip is an aerodrome, it then surely means it needs to be licensed or am i misunderstanding this page?:
http://www.caa.co.za/Pages/Airports/Abo ... ties-.aspx
Last edited by FDB on Mon Oct 01, 2018 3:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Drone flying on your own Farm?

Unread post by heisan » Mon Oct 01, 2018 3:46 pm

FDB wrote:
Mon Oct 01, 2018 3:42 pm
How are people supposed to know where all the private microlight strips are?
That is a problem that will be very difficult to fix.
And how does SAMAA apply to a guy who just bought a DJI Mavic for his son to use on their farm?
Not at all.
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Re: Drone flying on your own Farm?

Unread post by Rotor kop » Mon Oct 01, 2018 3:56 pm

FDB wrote:
Mon Oct 01, 2018 11:58 am
Why would people need licenses to just come fly them by us?
We for example have friends that are avid wildlife and landscape photographers that now also want to get into some creative shooting using drones. It would make no sense for them to first get a license just to come hone their drone based photography skills there by us surely?
That is the kind of drone pilots we would like to welcome there. Ones that have no need to fly high and fast. Where the focus is on getting better at drone based photography rather than seeing how high and far and fast they can go.

We also have other friends that participate in quad races. Those guys need a flat open area and do some fast flying but at very very low altitudes.

So both those disciplines we thought would be fine to allow. Neither we believe need any licensing?
I dont think wildlife and drone can be used in the same sentence. Not sure what your buddies intend doing but i sincerely hope it is not like some right half wits do and haras wildlife with their toys. Plenty wildlife out there gets chased and provoked by irrisponsible insect "pilots".
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Re: Drone flying on your own Farm?

Unread post by FDB » Mon Oct 01, 2018 4:42 pm

Wildlife gets chased and provoked by idiots on foot and by car way more than drones. That does not mean wildlife and vehicles or wildlife and hiking cant be used in the same sentence.
Helicopters doing counts.. same thing.

Not sure what you mean.
Take a look at the video shared above. You get some seriously good footage using a drone. If you are after good footage, the last thing you want is scattering animals. Most guys doing wildlife photography are serious animal lovers. Those that spend 40k plus on equipment to photograph the magnificent creatures even moreso.

But i think im probably missing your point.
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Re: Drone flying on your own Farm?

Unread post by Ricoby » Tue Oct 02, 2018 6:55 am

Easy solution... set up a private club and register with SAMAA. There are a few model flying clubs around that are private and registered with SAMAA. It just means that all your members and visitors must also be registered with SAMAA. You can charge an annual membership for the regulars and a "Landing" fee to day visitors. Of course it would mean that the "Pilots" would have to obtain SAMAA proffiencies. Maybe I would even join you under those circumstances as I am also an amateur photographer with a DJI Phantom 3 Pro as well as holding a Silver rated fixed wing SAMAA profiency.
Best thing to do is to have a chat with Bob Skinner at SAMAA and get the right information. If you ask questions here, you will always get shot down by the many unemployed RPL holders.
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Re: Drone flying on your own Farm?

Unread post by skytrooper » Tue Oct 02, 2018 8:03 am

thats why you need to have a radio with you
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Re: Drone flying on your own Farm?

Unread post by SlowApproach » Tue Oct 02, 2018 8:55 am

Considering what the OP wants to achieve, registering a club (like any other model aircraft club) that operates under the auspices of SAMAA would be the way to go methinks. Utilising club facilities, paid-up members and paid-up guests can then legitimately fly their plasticies to build and hone their skills without undue interference from anybody.

What members do (or want to do) on a professional or semi-professional basis outside of the club is their own indaba. Then they would have to comply with all the ASLs, ROCs and other TLAs (Three-Letter Acronyms) of Part 101 ops. Not the club’s problem. (This really is no different to a professional airline pilot who flies model aircraft for a hobby. At the club he’s just another member enjoying his craft, subject to the rules & regs of the club and SAMAA. Outside of the club he’s subject to all the rules & regs that applies to his particular vocation).
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