Hypocrisy defined

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Horace Blok
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Re: Hypocrisy defined

Unread post by Horace Blok » Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:58 am

In my short lifetime, I've witnessed climate change. As a young kid, a white Christmas in Europe was far more likely in the 50/60's. So I'd rather err towards the side of being conservative and take "global warming" seriously. Whats the down side?

The topic of overpopulation here in SA - the motivation is completely screwed up. Grants rather if the youngsters DON'T get themselves up the spout. Let the clever actuaries work out what's best and how grants can be best used to help ALL of us.
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Re: Hypocrisy defined

Unread post by HJK 414 » Fri Aug 02, 2019 11:37 am

Horace Blok wrote:
Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:58 am
In my short lifetime, I've witnessed climate change. As a young kid, a white Christmas in Europe was far more likely in the 50/60's. So I'd rather err towards the side of being conservative and take "global warming" seriously. Whats the down side?
…………….

Horace,

I think that most of us are on the same side of the fence.
YET ….. iinm .....Most of us are also fed up with these Climate clowns that tell us what to do to "save the planet" whilst flying around in private planes - living in huge mansions and spending endless time telling us to stop with what we are doing.
Once they start living what they preach - I will take them serious - until then ……...

JK
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Re: Hypocrisy defined

Unread post by nicofly » Fri Aug 02, 2019 11:52 am

What a desperate way to try and find "justification" The dienier loons are far beyond off the charts so desperate they are lol...

Just because a few rich people come together racking up media publicity for a good cause using fossil fuels doesn't make the problem of Human Induced Climate Change all of a sudden automatically non existent ! !

The extent deniers will go to prove to themselves in their own little false reality is menacingly amusing.

How about talking about the GLOBAL OIL industry BURNING a DWARFING amount of OIL EVERYDAY to yes you actually guessed it, hold meetings that actually PROMOTE the ongoing Sickening Pollution And Destruction of the earth. ? ? ? ?

No lets rather talk about the pollution they generate every SECOND without even having to hold any meetings ! ! ! ! !

Again this thread is an Utter JOKE ! ! ! !
Last edited by nicofly on Fri Aug 02, 2019 11:55 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Hypocrisy defined

Unread post by Marius Schrenk » Fri Aug 02, 2019 11:54 am

snoopy wrote:
Fri Aug 02, 2019 9:41 am
Image
:lol: :lol: =D> =D>
Politics attracts crooks and lawyers,most of the time its the same person.
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Re: Hypocrisy defined

Unread post by nicofly » Fri Aug 02, 2019 11:57 am

Marius Schrenk wrote:
Fri Aug 02, 2019 11:54 am
snoopy wrote:
Fri Aug 02, 2019 9:41 am
Image
:lol: :lol: =D> =D>
Indeed.. #-o =D>
The Deniers as Amusing as ever... :lol: :lol: #-o #-o
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Re: Hypocrisy defined

Unread post by Jack Welles » Fri Aug 02, 2019 11:58 am

Horace Blok wrote:
Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:58 am
In my short lifetime, I've witnessed climate change. As a young kid, a white Christmas in Europe was far more likely in the 50/60's. So I'd rather err towards the side of being conservative and take "global warming" seriously. Whats the down side?

The topic of overpopulation here in SA - the motivation is completely screwed up. Grants rather if the youngsters DON'T get themselves up the spout. Let the clever actuaries work out what's best and how grants can be best used to help ALL of us.
It's a lot more complicated than that. A decent, caring, modern, civilized society (which is what us third-world countries all, no doubt, aspire to be) doesn't allow its underprivileged young (or any others) to starve to death (no matter how dof the circumstances that gave rise to them being born in the first place) and to be denied medical treatment when ill. I'm agnostic but in this regard my views coincide with most major Christian religions.

From an over-population point of view, research has shown that the more educated and sophisticated people become the smaller the families they have. This is also amply demonstrated in mature societies/countries such as Germany etc, where they're actually worried about a slowly reducing population. What SA needs to expand rapidly is its middle-class which is growing too slowly.

The answer (admittedly so far missing) lies in education, work opportunities, improved living standards etc. As it happens this would also help with crime.

Thus the real debate is in how to make that happen. As a liberal capitalist I favour macro-economic and structural reforms, for starters such as, relaxing labour laws (for example, employees/unions have too much power in SA), privatisation of SOE's, cutting the state work force, improving education. For more ideas I would defer to those who are much smarter than I am. Socialists would, of course, have different ideas.
Last edited by Jack Welles on Fri Aug 02, 2019 12:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Hypocrisy defined

Unread post by viki » Fri Aug 02, 2019 12:01 pm

nicofly wrote:
Thu Aug 01, 2019 7:01 pm
This argument is ludicrous at best, this entire thread is Hypocricy in itself !

How much money is being spent on climate change to prevent it ????

The Question that should be asked is How much MONEY is being Spent on Promoting and Encouraging Climate Change ! ! ! ! ! !

Now let me tell you if a buffoon high up in a tree put 1 and 1 together he will realize that BIG OIL Spending in just a few months, DWARFS climate change spending of it's entire existence ! ! ! !

This thread is all about Deniers trying to "feel good" trying to find some sort of twisted justification for FOSSIL FUELS Destroying the earth, spending an uncomprehending amount aggressively every darn day in creating infrastructure that Creates and Encourages the Destruction of our planet which DIRECTLY affects the earth's population ! ! !

And they dare, yes they DARE to come and try blame it squarely on the few peanuts climate change prevention is costing compared to FOSSIL FUEL spending. REALLY ????!!!

Just imagine if all Fossil fuel expenditures went into actually saving Humanities problems discussed here ! ! ! !

What an Absolute Joke this comparison is ! ! ! !
=D> =D>
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Re: Hypocrisy defined

Unread post by Fransw » Fri Aug 02, 2019 12:24 pm

Smell the roses my china!
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Re: Hypocrisy defined

Unread post by Jack Welles » Fri Aug 02, 2019 1:52 pm

Fransw wrote:
Fri Aug 02, 2019 12:24 pm
Smell the roses my china!
images-3.jpeg
Vivino didn't know what to make of that :? :lol:
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Re: Hypocrisy defined

Unread post by Wilco » Fri Aug 02, 2019 3:42 pm

nicofly wrote:
Fri Aug 02, 2019 11:52 am
What a desperate way to try and find "justification" The dienier loons are far beyond off the charts so desperate they are lol...

Just because a few rich people come together racking up media publicity for a good cause using fossil fuels doesn't make the problem of Human Induced Climate Change all of a sudden automatically non existent ! !

Again this thread is an Utter JOKE ! ! ! !
You fail to realize it's the OPTICS, right?

I mean all of those folks could have perhaps met and taken a 777 to Palermo for their gathering. I think that would have sent a much better message than people arriving on 140 jets...

And then on top of that what kind of scientific credentials do guys like DiCaprio or Bloom have to lecture us on climate change? I mean when I think of climate change the first guy I wanna talk to is Orlando Bloom....and of course when I think of aviation experts, the first person that springs to mind is Richard Quest...…C'mon.

The best part is with their millions, they are lecturing the average Joe Schmoe that he needs to come up with money to buy an electric vehicle and make his home environmentally sustainable. Easy for them to do; much harder for a guy that is struggling with a mortgage and trying to put food on the table....

And a bit more about our climate champion Leonardo...a bi-continental New Year's Eve...

https://news.yahoo.com/leonardo-dicapri ... 25959.html

Or Bono, transporting his hat in a first class seat
http://www.contactmusic.com/bono/news/b ... gotten-hat

And yet these clowns lecture us and you want us to take them seriously. Gimme a break...

If you guys really want to have a serious discussion about climate change and have the world take you all seriously, I suggest you start off with finding different "brand ambassadors"....Because those clowns are doing more harm than good.
Last edited by Wilco on Fri Aug 02, 2019 4:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Hypocrisy defined

Unread post by nicofly » Fri Aug 02, 2019 4:01 pm

Wilco wrote:
Fri Aug 02, 2019 3:42 pm
nicofly wrote:
Fri Aug 02, 2019 11:52 am
What a desperate way to try and find "justification" The dienier loons are far beyond off the charts so desperate they are lol...

Just because a few rich people come together racking up media publicity for a good cause using fossil fuels doesn't make the problem of Human Induced Climate Change all of a sudden automatically non existent ! !

Again this thread is an Utter JOKE ! ! ! !
You fail to realize it's the OPTICS, right?

I mean all of those folks could have perhaps met and taken a 777 to Palermo for their gathering. I think that would have sent a much better message than people arriving on 140 jets...

And then on top of that what do guys like DiCaprio or Bloom have to lecture us on climate change? I mean when I think of climate change the first guy I wanna talk to is Orlando Bloom....and of course when I think of aviation experts, the first person that springs to mind is Richard Quest...…C'mon.

The best part is with their millions, they are lecturing the average Joe Schmoe that he needs to come up with money to buy an electric vehicle and make his home environmentally sustainable. Easy for them to do; much harder for a guy that is struggling with a mortgage and trying to put food on the table....

And a bit more about our climate champion Leonardo...a bi-continental New Year's Eve...

https://news.yahoo.com/leonardo-dicapri ... 25959.html

Or Bono, transporting his hat in a first class seat
http://www.contactmusic.com/bono/news/b ... gotten-hat

And yet these clowns lecture us and you want us to take them seriously. Gimme a break...
What i said this yes: "Just because a few rich people come together racking up media publicity for a good cause using fossil fuels doesn't make the problem of Human Induced Climate Change all of a sudden automatically non existent ! !"

I do not fail to understand the point at all, but i made my point clear as the focus seemed to
be trying to assume just because THEY are doing something i do not agree with. (Yes i agree with you) Does not mean that the problem we have is gone, they could have all taken a trip in a 777 YES, they could've reduced their carbon spending a lot more YES.

But at least they Went to a meeting where they discussed something serious in a serious way, instead when the Fossil Fuel Empire decides to go to a meeting they do it by the by the same means, and Worse, they have a WORLDWIDE Empire producing Emissions every second, and on top of THAT, Promoting More Fossil Fuel Infrastructure worldwide at THOSE meetings ! ! Instead of discussing ways they could use their unlimited resources to change the world and promoting Green Infrastructure ! !
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Re: Hypocrisy defined

Unread post by Wilco » Fri Aug 02, 2019 4:08 pm

You do realize that the appetite for fossil fuels is in the BRICs and developing nations. Wouldn't it be better if they had that conference say somewhere in India or China in order to bring about more environmental consciousness and awareness in those areas...The West is getting pretty good at alternate energy and minimizing carbon emissions.....

But you do realize that those fossil fuels have helped countries such as India and China expand economically. In India alone, this economic expansion has allowed over 300 million to escape poverty and join the ranks of the lower middle/middle class over the last two decades.

You do realize that you argument will fall on deaf ears. It's easy to scream climate change- baaaad, the earth is coming to an end in 10 years, and virtue signal if one is from a middle or upper middle class background... But people in those countries, their first need is making sure they have the necessities: food, shelter...etc....Just take a look at Maslow's hierarchy of needs and before people can reach those levels of self awareness and self fulfillment you are idealistically talking about, they need to reach certain other milestones first.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maslow%27 ... y_of_needs
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Re: Hypocrisy defined

Unread post by nicofly » Fri Aug 02, 2019 4:15 pm

Wilco wrote:
Fri Aug 02, 2019 4:08 pm
You do realize that the appetite for fossil fuels is in the BRICs and developing nations. Wouldn't it be better if they had that conference say somewhere in India or China? To bring about more environmental consciousness in those areas...The West is getting pretty good at alternate energy and minimizing carbon emissions.....

But you do realize that those fossil fuels have helped countries such as India and China expand economically. This economic expansion has allowed over 300 millions to escape poverty and join the ranks of the lower middle/middle class over the last two decades.

You do realize that you argument will fall on deaf ears. It's easy to scream climate change- baaaad, the earth is coming to an end in 10 years, and virtue signal if one is from a middle or upper middle class background... But people in those countries, their first need is making sure they have the necessities: food, shelter...etc....Just take a look at Maslow's hierarchy of needs and before people can reach those levels of self awareness and self fulfillment you are idealistically talking about, they need to reach certain other milestones first.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maslow%27 ... y_of_needs
Who Instigated the Appetite for fossil fuels to begin with ?
Who could've lead the world into a different path to begin with ? Maybe not in the beginning but definitely later on.
You do Realize who's fault this is to begin with.

I'm not disagreeing with much of your points, specifically what you are discussing is a difficult topic, however it could've been much different by now if the World Powers did something about it in the past rather than wait it out until the problem explodes.
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Re: Hypocrisy defined

Unread post by HJK 414 » Fri Aug 02, 2019 4:29 pm

nicofly wrote:
Fri Aug 02, 2019 4:15 pm

Who Instigated the Appetite for fossil fuels to begin with ?
Who could've lead the world into a different path to begin with ? Maybe not in the beginning but definitely later on.
You do Realize who's fault this is to begin with.

I'm not disagreeing with much of your points, specifically what you are discussing is a difficult topic, however it could've been much different by now if the World Powers did something about it in the past rather than wait it out until the problem explodes.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

You can't help yourself can you ?
Sell your car - stop breeding - lead the way .......... :roll:


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Re: Hypocrisy defined

Unread post by Wilco » Fri Aug 02, 2019 4:36 pm

It was the West that instigated this appetite...And so what.
Look at the wonders of fossil fuels. Society has grown by leaps and bounds. Billions of people have joined the middle class thanks to fossil fuels.
Hydrocarbons were/are the driving force of not only Western civilization but civilization as a whole.

Hydrocarbons have been synthesized to produce a myriad of products that you can find in EVERY singe item in your house.

The argument that you just used is silly. Where would society be today without the advent of the internal combustion engine. And think of all of the advancements that IC engine did for man kind. So many other technologies evolved from that.

Alternate technologies are being developed. As society gets more technologically advanced we will eventually become a Type 1 Civilization.
I read at this stage of mankind we are at 70% of a Type 1 civilization

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kardashev_scale.

No offense, but you come off as every virtue signaling woke climate activist....You guys get a bit too emotional and not much substance is behind your arguments and just try to shame others that have some valid questions/concerns .

I have an engineering degree from one of the top universities in the world (always ranked in the Top 5); but I would never profess or proclaim to either be a climate change denier or a climate change believer. I do know there are lots of nuances in this debate and would like those things hashed out first before we fundamentally change the source of energy that fuels our world and economy. But hey, that's just ignorant me.

But I'm sure glad we have intellectual heavyweights such as Leo and Orlando leading the way...……….Unfortunately, empty vessels make the most noise.....
Last edited by Wilco on Fri Aug 02, 2019 4:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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