Strict SAA in the 70's

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excolonial
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Re: Strict SAA in the 70's

Unread post by excolonial » Tue Sep 17, 2019 11:57 am

Darren wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 6:39 pm
Peterson a charlatan? I am not a member of his fan club, but on balance I would say his is a necessary voice for those marginalised by the relentless invective of a deranged media. I would wager he has helped far more than he has hindered, by any reasoned measure that means he is no snake oil salesman. I have yet to see him effectively debated by the self appointed intellectual "titans". I have certainly seen him relentlessly vilified with very little reference to facts.

So many generalisations.
Crime and Divorce are down? There are certainly some countries where this is the case, but in many of the Major Western nations this is demonstrably false. There was a downward trend a few decades ago, but not now.

Western universities are not dominated by leftists, really? The trend has been left for decades, and despite your assertion, this does not represent a societal shift, but that is certainly not for lack of trying. A cabal of likeminded people is not what I was suggesting, more a tendency for college professors to be left leaning at best, and many are indeed avowed marxists. This has certainly affected the national discourse, but as is becoming clear, this does not actually reflect the sentiments of societies at large. It has certainly affected the way the unthinking masses behave. The turn away from this across the western world, is not populism, a pejorative term coined by the usual suspects, but rather an unsurprising reaction to the relentless nonsense being proposed by a deranged media, and corrupt out of touch politicians.

Your analysis of the performance of western armies is perfunctory at best. I have a friend in the British Army who was in direct contact with the top chap in the British military in Iraq. I think you will find that he does not agree with your diagnosis. The best are getting better, the rest (outside the US) - not so much. They are better trained, better equipped, better supported than any army before them, and society will no longer allow the cannon fodder approach to soldiering with some notable exceptions. Yet here still you are comparing apples with oranges, professionals versus conscripts, hi tech versus no tech, so a simple linear analysis of the skills of each soldier is not possible. Vietnam? Read Macnamaras folly, etc etc To cap it all, who is training the new generation?

Leftist domination is a fairly simple thing to explain and indeed demonstrate, it means that the bulk of College professors are leftists, nothing more nothing less. I believe the lack of balance is doing very real harm to society. The lack of opposition means the perpetuation of an ideology to a position of extremis.

I find the fact that you see no issue with the passing of those bizarre, vague, and nearly all encompassing hate speech laws in Canada shows that when it comes to this sort of thing we are diametrically opposed, so any further discussion is probably wasted.

When it came to Iran, you and I agree pretty much 100%. Funny old world isn't it.
The older I get, the more I am convinced that "A Confederacy of Dunces" is non fiction.
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richard C
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Re: Strict SAA in the 70's

Unread post by richard C » Tue Sep 17, 2019 12:20 pm

excolonial wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 11:57 am

Peterson a charlatan? I am not a member of his fan club, but on balance I would say his is a necessary voice for those marginalised by the relentless invective of a deranged media. I would wager he has helped far more than he has hindered, by any reasoned measure that means he is no snake oil salesman. I have yet to see him effectively debated by the self appointed intellectual "titans". I have certainly seen him relentlessly vilified with very little reference to facts.

So many generalisations.
Crime and Divorce are down? There are certainly some countries where this is the case, but in many of the Major Western nations this is demonstrably false. There was a downward trend a few decades ago, but not now.

Western universities are not dominated by leftists, really? The trend has been left for decades, and despite your assertion, this does not represent a societal shift, but that is certainly not for lack of trying. A cabal of likeminded people is not what I was suggesting, more a tendency for college professors to be left leaning at best, and many are indeed avowed marxists. This has certainly affected the national discourse, but as is becoming clear, this does not actually reflect the sentiments of societies at large. It has certainly affected the way the unthinking masses behave. The turn away from this across the western world, is not populism, a pejorative term coined by the usual suspects, but rather an unsurprising reaction to the relentless nonsense being proposed by a deranged media, and corrupt out of touch politicians.

……..

Leftist domination is a fairly simple thing to explain and indeed demonstrate, it means that the bulk of College professors are leftists, nothing more nothing less. I believe the lack of balance is doing very real harm to society. The lack of opposition means the perpetuation of an ideology to a position of extremis.

I find the fact that you see no issue with the passing of those bizarre, vague, and nearly all encompassing hate speech laws in Canada shows that when it comes to this sort of thing we are diametrically opposed, so any further discussion is probably wasted.

When it came to Iran, you and I agree pretty much 100%. Funny old world isn't it.
Here is where I struggle with you, excolonial.

Your language is peppered with insults and snipes, yet you purport to hold a rational and informed debate. Your language is deliberately provocative, and I am sure if I referred to you and your rightist leaning friends as 'ignorant', 'ornery', 'hicks' or 'rednecks' you would rightly take exception. As soon as I see your selection of adjectives, I lose interest in the content. It is clearly so prejudicial and couched in 'rooi-gevaar' mentality that it is like reading an apartheid propaganda pamphlet. Really - do you think there is something those college professors may know that you don't ? That maybe the underpinning requirement of capitalism, steady and continuous growth, is failing, and so therefore, is capitalism itself. That the next generation may have to look for other economic models that will operate in a stagnant market place.

The green is just added as 'ironic content'.
Grant all equity and dignity.
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Re: Strict SAA in the 70's

Unread post by excolonial » Tue Sep 17, 2019 12:33 pm

The terms used are deliberate and meant exactly as typed. They are certainly not aimed at Darren, and I think that is evident.

Societal discourse has become extremely toxic, and my response to the ranting and raving of the media is apt and I think measured in comparison.

So let me be clear, the usual suspects are not Darren, although he may agree with them. Intellectual titans are those anointed in the media to opine relentlessly about the evils of men like Peterson, again not Darren, although he may again agree with them.

That perverse Canadian law is extremely worrying, and Petersons position on it brave and rational. It has already been used, and will continue to be used to suppress anyone that disagrees with its authors. If you are even a casual observer of history, this kind of control should ring huge alarm bells.

We will not agree, and the twain shall probably never meet. But that is not a problem as long as there is balance.
The older I get, the more I am convinced that "A Confederacy of Dunces" is non fiction.
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Re: Strict SAA in the 70's

Unread post by richard C » Tue Sep 17, 2019 1:02 pm

excolonial

I was not trying to imply you were applying the terms to Darren - my wording could be misunderstood now I read it that way.

What I mean is this - Fox News is the font of all wisdom. CNN is 'deranged' and sprouts 'relentless nonsense'.

It is extremely tiring and reflects poorly on your analytical and interpretive skills, which I well know are not lacking.

I don't get my news from either of those sources because they are both heavily compromised by strong political agenda. So to keep reading the word 'deranged' as applied to all my sources of information (or anybody who disagrees with you) is belittling and presumptive.

As stated earlier, for my own part, I read outside of my comfort zone. I can't learn anything if I limit my reading material to points of view that are already aligned with my own. It's why I pay attention to what you say - we fundamentally disagree on some pretty significant stuff. Why ? How can two informed opinions be so distant from one another ? How can we perceive the same reality from such diametric poles ? Is there a shared point of departure, or are our cultural and educational filters distorting our realities to the point that we literally can no longer trust what our eyes see ?

Telling me my references are 'deranged' doesn't help demystify the paradox.

On the same tack, it's also the reason I pay careful attention to Marius Schrenk. In our case we do indeed come from very different backgrounds and experiences - and so therefore I can learn a lot from him. When he takes the time to articulate his challenges he presents compelling and persuasive arguments. And I have it on good authority that he is in fact a fine gentleman and somebody I would no doubt get on very well with in person ! :lol:
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Re: Strict SAA in the 70's

Unread post by excolonial » Tue Sep 17, 2019 2:40 pm

richard C wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 1:02 pm

What I mean is this - Fox News is the font of all wisdom. CNN is 'deranged' and sprouts 'relentless nonsense'.

It is extremely tiring and reflects poorly on your analytical and interpretive skills, which I well know are not lacking.
Cnn has proven time and time again since their very foundation that truth is an irrelevance. FOX is the butt of many jokes by those "in the know", yet they are starting to seem like the voice of reason in a cauldron of hate filled madness. CNN are not alone, on the contrary, FOX news stands in isolation.

If you are suggesting that there is not a persistent agenda in most of the MSM, then you are not the only one who finds it all rather tiring. It is self evident, often admitted in private, but it seems that no matter how much evidence of malfeasance is provided, some refuse to accept that there is a problem. That is a problem.
The older I get, the more I am convinced that "A Confederacy of Dunces" is non fiction.

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