Beechcraft B1900 Rating direct from Single Engine piston

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caruiters
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Beechcraft B1900 Rating direct from Single Engine piston

Unread post by caruiters » Thu Apr 09, 2015 7:17 pm

Hi guys,

Does anyone know of an ATO that can provide a B1900 rating to a candidate such as myself without a Multi-Engine twin piston rating?

Simuflight, from whom I have received a quote, stipulates an ME piston rating as pre-requisite.

Can anyone assist regarding the matter - I am a bit 'two-minded' about spending R65 000 for piston twin rating, with the B1900 costing approx. R5000 more.

Your comments and advice is greatly appreciated.

Kind regards
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Re: Beechcraft B1900 Rating direct from Single Engine piston

Unread post by HJK 414 » Thu Apr 09, 2015 7:58 pm

caruiters wrote:Hi guys,

Does anyone know of an ATO that can provide a B1900 rating to a candidate such as myself without a Multi-Engine twin piston rating?

Simuflight, from whom I have received a quote, stipulates an ME piston rating as pre-requisite.

Can anyone assist regarding the matter - I am a bit 'two-minded' about spending R65 000 for piston twin rating, with the B1900 costing approx. R5000 more.

Your comments and advice is greatly appreciated.

Kind regards
Hi...
I can only add to your misery .....
I wanted a C90 (King Air) rating (PT6), but was knocked back as well .... had to do the Piston Twin first ....
Ended up buying a piston twin - (C414) - so it became a moot point ....
But I could not find a way around it then ....

The argument was simply lack of experience - ( I had approx. 500 Hr single time at that point .....) the Turbine and the speed (and possible asymmetric handling) simply being to much to handle .... and having to gain some experience and hours before doing the Turbine endorsement. To be honest - after flying approx. 1200 hrs in a C414 - I can guarantee you - NO WAY would I have been able to handle that PT6 without some piston multi engine (slower !!) time .... I flew an Aero Commander Turbine a few years ago - and that is a whole different world - I can tell you. You get left behind by the aircraft without any effort ......

As for converting and doing the B1900 conversion - have you given any thought as to how you will find a insurance company that will cover you with NIL twin time.
I think you will find it very hard to accomplish....

Do the Piston twin time - a BE76 (Duchess) is very docile...... Try getting some time on that - or a Baron ......and then try for a conversion,
is the best advice I could offer you.

Jan.
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Re: Beechcraft B1900 Rating direct from Single Engine piston

Unread post by Charlie-bravo8 » Fri Apr 10, 2015 9:14 am

I personally would be very intimidated with the idea of jumping straight into a B1900 from say a 182 or something of the sorts...way to much aeroplane for me 8-[ 8-[ 8-[
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Re: Beechcraft B1900 Rating direct from Single Engine piston

Unread post by happyskipper » Fri Apr 10, 2015 9:46 am

The problem you are facing is there for a reason. As Janklomp and CB stated above - the conversion to the B1900 is no biggie, once you have twin experience in "slower" less powerful twins.

The idea of going from a single piston to a twin turbine is, quite frankly, ridiculous and dangerous. There are no short cuts in aviation, and those that take them, regardless of rules/regulations and sage advice, tend to become statistics in very short order.

Please heed the advice of those who have been there, done that..... above!

Good luck with your aviation career.
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Re: Beechcraft B1900 Rating direct from Single Engine piston

Unread post by Snitch » Fri Apr 10, 2015 12:07 pm

B1900 requires a type rating, not just a class rating and conversion.


Got an ATPL ?
If not this also applies
61.09.2

(3) An applicant for a type or class rating on a high performance single pilot aeroplane who is
not the holder of an ATPL, or who has not obtained credit for the ATPL theoretical knowledge
examinations, must undergo additional training as set out in Document SA-CATS 61.
Doubt the CAA would even consider giving a P1 rating. Many just get P2


Would also not even consider doing it anywhere other than the large organisations with their full flight simulators.
No way you can properly train for the complex emergencies these aircraft can face without them.
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Re: Beechcraft B1900 Rating direct from Single Engine piston

Unread post by dr727 » Fri Apr 10, 2015 1:11 pm

a case of the bigger the wallet the less experience required...money substituting experience.
In my days nothing short of 1,000 tt, at least a few hundred on twins and only then twin turbines but only if you behaved and asked nicely.
not suggesting things are better or worse now but...

Of course no harm in asking and the replies are proper advsie
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Re: Beechcraft B1900 Rating direct from Single Engine piston

Unread post by HJK 414 » Fri Apr 10, 2015 2:05 pm

dr727 wrote:a case of the bigger the wallet the less experience required...money substituting experience.
In my days nothing short of 1,000 tt, at least a few hundred on twins and only then twin turbines but only if you behaved and asked nicely.
not suggesting things are better or worse now but...

Of course no harm in asking and the replies are proper advsie

Still the same as far as I know.....
You need a substantial twin engine "experience curve" before being stepping up to Turbine Twin........
And if the flying school has any doubts - or you are at the bottom end of the hours flown schedule .....
you will get some ICUS time imposed.......

I could imagine that a BIG wallet can probably buy you some acceleration through the process .....
Yet I would not know which Insurance company would bite,.....they simply would not accept it in my view....
And turbine twins are mostly Pax or Cargo - which means Insurance Obligations no end......

.
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Re: Beechcraft B1900 Rating direct from Single Engine piston

Unread post by Burner » Fri Apr 10, 2015 5:18 pm

Snitch wrote:B1900 requires a type rating, not just a class rating and conversion.


Got an ATPL ?
If not this also applies
61.09.2

(3) An applicant for a type or class rating on a high performance single pilot aeroplane who is
not the holder of an ATPL, or who has not obtained credit for the ATPL theoretical knowledge
examinations, must undergo additional training as set out in Document SA-CATS 61.
Doubt the CAA would even consider giving a P1 rating. Many just get P2


Would also not even consider doing it anywhere other than the large organisations with their full flight simulators.
No way you can properly train for the complex emergencies these aircraft can face without them.

There is no such thing as a P2 rating on a B1900. As it can be operated single crew, the CAA only issues P1 ratings on it. To the original poster, maybe contact Griffon or 43rd advanced, and see if they can help you.
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Re: Beechcraft B1900 Rating direct from Single Engine piston

Unread post by fly1981 » Fri Apr 10, 2015 5:24 pm

What burner said, the infamous p2 rating on a 1900 does not exist. Get hold of Anton from griffon, he would be the person that would be able to give you the best advise. I don't see the issue.
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Re: Beechcraft B1900 Rating direct from Single Engine piston

Unread post by HJK 414 » Fri Apr 10, 2015 5:46 pm

fly1981 wrote:........................ I don't see the issue.
Sorry,
You do not see the issue ?
As in - it is possible to obtain a twin Turbine P1800 endorsement / rating with only Piston single time base ??
Or am I mis-interpreting completely ??

JK
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Re: Beechcraft B1900 Rating direct from Single Engine piston

Unread post by rare bird » Fri Apr 10, 2015 7:18 pm

read the topic / thread on twins and asymmetrical flight (their tendency to roll / flick on their back when you lose one engine / drop a wing - if you are not wide awake and have trained hard for this scenario). There are no short cuts, even if someone tempts you.
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=103950&start=1200 go to page 81
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Re: Beechcraft B1900 Rating direct from Single Engine piston

Unread post by Snitch » Fri Apr 10, 2015 7:23 pm

Burner wrote:
There is no such thing as a P2 rating on a B1900. As it can be operated single crew, the CAA only issues P1 ratings on it.
Ok, ill take your word on it.
Was told by others they had P2 on B1900, though they work in the US. :?: :?:
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Re: Beechcraft B1900 Rating direct from Single Engine piston

Unread post by rare bird » Fri Apr 10, 2015 7:30 pm

you are correct, snitch that B1900 requires a type rating, not just a class rating and conversion
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Re: Beechcraft B1900 Rating direct from Single Engine piston

Unread post by JCA » Fri Apr 10, 2015 7:59 pm

In the mid 70's I received my PPL and was subsequently rated on Cherokee 181. Just as a reminder..... Single engine, Fixed pitch prop, fixed undercarriage etc etc.
Normally one might expect to then get a rating on a VP prop aerie, C182 and the like. Then maybe a retractable, plus VP of course, and then e v e n t u a l l y a twin engine rating.

Not so for me. VP, retractable, Twin all in one go. Cherokee to Aztec in one step. Could have had the same effect as 'Two step'. Looking back on this it was probably one of the most, if not the most, risky activities I have ever engaged in. (And I used to dig up un-exploded bombs!!!) But under some pressure from my employers ( Not Av related) and their chequebook, agreed and continued up to twin rating. I consider myself very lucky to have survived. (even from the bombs) Would not do it again even in my next life and would certainly advise against anyone else contemplating a similar move. ( including the bombs). Fortunately my bucket of luck held out but never even came close to flying the Aztec and getting the necessary time under my belt to be able to be fully competent on the aerie. Moving to SA stopped the Twin time pdq.
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Re: Beechcraft B1900 Rating direct from Single Engine piston

Unread post by AOYB » Sat Apr 11, 2015 9:24 am

The 1900 is easier to fly than the piston twins. But what do I know, I only have 9.6 piston twin hours and 2400 b190 hours.
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