Low flying again

What your instructor never taught you. Continuing your education and learning from others. Flight safety topics and accident/incident discussions.

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cage
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Re: Low flying again

Unread post by cage » Wed Jan 30, 2019 9:55 am

jimdavis wrote:
Wed Jan 30, 2019 9:53 am
Cage, it is not a matter of being unforgiving, its a matter of caring enough to make a loud noise in the interest of safety.
Not disagreeing with you, and caring is a good thing.
It was a broad comment based on the tone of many opinions from members over the years.
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Re: Low flying again

Unread post by richard C » Wed Jan 30, 2019 9:56 am

We do not need to stand by and watch our friends march towards their graves. We can call out to them with wisdom hewn from our own reckless past.
Grant all equity and dignity.
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cage
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Re: Low flying again

Unread post by cage » Wed Jan 30, 2019 10:09 am

richard C wrote:
Wed Jan 30, 2019 9:56 am
We do not need to stand by and watch our friends march towards their graves. We can call out to them with wisdom hewn from our own reckless past.
Of course, but if you start out with "Piet, You're flying like a puss-in-boots" he will either give you a klap, ignore you or both.
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Re: Low flying again

Unread post by richard C » Wed Jan 30, 2019 10:17 am

...or he may be fascinated by the story of the time you turned your Cessna on its back while trying to perform a PROPER incipient.

The threat of the unknown-unknown can only be mitigated by illumination.
Grant all equity and dignity.
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cage
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Re: Low flying again

Unread post by cage » Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:35 pm

richard C wrote:
Wed Jan 30, 2019 10:17 am
...or he may be fascinated by the story of the time you turned your Cessna on its back while trying to perform a PROPER incipient.

The threat of the unknown-unknown can only be mitigated by illumination.
Agreed.
My cynical view, though, is that those who generally complain about behaviour generally don't understand what has actually happened and it is only the more experienced that chime in later.
I reckon that most will have nothing to say at a field, especially if it's a mate flying as he is a good oke, great pilot, knows what he is doing etc and are more likely to pat him (and I am intentionally saying him, ladies are far more sensible) on the back.
At worst they will tut tut over a beer at the pub and will have little to say apart from on an internet forum.
Perhaps that is over-cynical but that would often seem to be the case.
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Re: Low flying again

Unread post by Gandolf » Thu Jan 31, 2019 12:00 am

Gentleman this will be my last post on this subject. My original post was neither a whine or not understanding what I witnessed. It was a hope that the person's involved would read the post and think about what they had done. Further more people normally only showboat like that when there is an audience. So I was hoping a spectator on the ground would approach the pilots involved and broach the recklessness.
As far as the post stating, that most people complaining don't have the experience to judge the situation, I have been involved in aviation for 41 years, 30 of in a professional flying capacity, what I witnessed scared me. Perhaps because I realised a long time ago that I'm no Chuck Yeager and took a concious decision to compensate for that by attempting to be the safest pilot I could.
Jim thanks for your wise words and support, when we witness situations that we consider dangerous we need to speak up. Unfortunately with all your experience and wisdom, some just won't be listen or take note.
flyfano I think you're missing the point, we all make mistakes, in fact the stats show that no matter how well be trained pilots make 2 to 3 errors/mistakes every hour. It's about knowingly acting irresponsible and flouting the books and laws.

In my career I've witnessed to many deaths, and was hoping my post could by some miracle prevent one more, seems I was mistaken, there always some that will have fun without thinking of the consequences to be themselves or others.
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Re: Low flying again

Unread post by pietmeyer » Thu Jan 31, 2019 4:12 am

cage wrote:
Wed Jan 30, 2019 10:09 am

Of course, but if you start out with "Piet, You're flying like a puss-in-boots" he will either give you a klap, ignore you or both.

I am offended. We have never even met so how can you say that? :roll: Why not say that of Koos and Jan?
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Re: Low flying again

Unread post by richard C » Thu Jan 31, 2019 9:03 am

pietmeyer wrote:
Thu Jan 31, 2019 4:12 am
cage wrote:
Wed Jan 30, 2019 10:09 am

Of course, but if you start out with "Piet, You're flying like a puss-in-boots" he will either give you a klap, ignore you or both.

I am offended. We have never even met so how can you say that? :roll: Why not say that of Koos and Jan?
:lol: :lol:
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Re: Low flying again

Unread post by apollo11 » Thu Jan 31, 2019 9:20 am

One of the best little posts I ever read...

"Years ago, as fresh testosterone driven 21-year-old 50 hour PPL, strongly under the impression that I was the Red Baron incarnate, I did some silly things with the club C172. If Avcom were in existence then, I would definitely have been the cause of a few threads starting with “Idiot”, “<<moderated - language>>” etc.

The late Frikkie Le Roux, ex SAAF and SAA pilot and fellow club member, saw me proudly displaying my newly acquired flying skills. He did not crap on me over the radio or even talked to me after landing. Later that afternoon when we were all having a few drinks in the clubhouse he came to me with a beer and an envelope.

He gave me the beer and put the envelope down in front of me. It had my name written on it. He then explained "pushing the envelope" to me.

An Envelope has four sides:

Side 1. Your limits
Side 2. The weathers limits
Side 3. The aircraft limits
Side 4. The unknown.

You stay within the first three, and something in the "unknown" side 4 goes wrong, your chance of survival is 3 to 1. You exceed any one of the first three, and something in the "unknown" goes wrong, the chance of survival becomes 50:50. Do the rest of the maths yourself….

That little sermon and the way he did it will always stay with me. Since then I never exceeded any of those limits…..maybe pushed it a couple of times, but never exceeded.

How many accidents could have been avoided if those first three limits were not pushed?"
Last edited by Ikarus on Thu Feb 04, 2010 1:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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