Barometer of failing as a state - South Africa

[snoopy]

not all police wear uniform or drive marked cars.

T-cross had all four tyres on to the very end - watch it again.

[propstrap]

not all police wear uniform or drive marked cars.

T-cross had all four tyres on to the very end - watch it again.

You may be right, I could not say for sure... but I think any SAPS promotional or training video would have had the dominating actors leaning more to representivity... IMHO...

[flysouth]

Some of the video you see here was taken while training SAPS to do the job. (former SAPS training present SAPS to do the work) Some that may look like civvies on video are actually SAPS officers, and you will clearly see uniformed SAPS officers in other parts of the video stepping into the scene. SAPS were present when the cars were pulled off the road.

How many armed response vehicles in your neighbourhood have sirens?

flysouth, ja possibly - I dont see a gun anywhere on the ground from the camera point of view. You cant use lethal force to protect assets like someone else's car. You may only use it if your life is at imminent risk. I may have missed it, but did not see anyone pointing a gun at the guy with the red shirt either.

If you really want to be in dwang, then shoot someone fleeing from a burglary or car theft.

That is why I mentioned "proportionality" - a doctrine that I personally and in the local context, find utterly preposterous! We are NOT in the Home Counties of Blighty!

We had a shooting in my neighbourhood, Olivedale, Randburg a couple of years or so back. Two guys tried to steal a car from a driveway and got it started but then stalled it in the road. Security guards from a local outfit were nearby and reacted, I heard the shots. I went outside to find a tall security guy, an African man, standing outside my gate with his pistol still in his hand. He told me that he and his colleague had tried to apprehend the two thieves but they ran in different directions, He shot one of them, who died on the scene. The other got away.

Out local Neighbourhood Watch leader told me that there was no trouble about that shooting from SAPS etc.

[snoopy]

I would not use that incident to use as advice to others who may end up in the same situation. If you perceive an immediate life threat aimed AT you different story.

In general contact crime in SA is back at 2008 levels after taking a bit of a dip between then and now on a national scale. It spiked upward after 2020.

verder gaan ek niks se nie - thread is drifting a bit now.

[cage]

High profile people being involved in crime has never surprised me at all...

Not an uncommon global trend, whether it be minor crime (shoplifting) or more severe.
I don't understand why who hijacks someone should cause more offense.
It is a horrifically traumatic crime, as all violent crime is.
No victim is going to feel better if the person was down and out or more offended if somehow "connected".

In this instance it would appear that whatever is left of the Mandela family, are effectively broke and fighting among themselves for what remains.
The grandson and the mates involved all allegedly have drug problems and have been unable to maintain or pay for the property, so appear to have resorted to crime.
The pistol used could not fire live rounds, not that this makes it any better.
On the face of it, it seems to be a typical cause for crime, with no other "connections", except for the name and location, which have obviously made headlines.

[apollo11]

Also worrying is the almost regular flow of farm attacks - another one just a few days ago, and the almost glossing over of the attacks some noise here and there but when one reads into the details it makes some pretty unpleasant reading, absolutely brutal attacks on elderly too often, and way outnumbered 2-4+ guys versus an old farmer or owner and his wife...

[Ugly Duckling]

Hopefully the start of more rolling heads

[Snitch]

How many armed response vehicles in your neighbourhood have sirens?

We have a couple.
They are generally special response vehicles within the armed response company and not the general 2 man team regular patrol bakkie/SUV.
They seem to do a lot of responding to the increasing amount of License Plate Recognition (LPR) cameras being installed in and around the suburbs or respond to large crimes together with their dog units and investigative staff.

Then there are other companies, similar to Nojack, that patrol the highways and an increasing amount of them are also being fitted with LPR cameras.


There are of course also many small one man in a Polo response companies still around, but many are being replaced by the more proactive companies that are not just reacting to alarms but trying to stamp out crime in the area before it happens and tracking down criminal teams.

[Snitch]

Also worrying is the almost regular flow of farm attacks - another one just a few days ago, and the almost glossing over of the attacks some noise here and there but when one reads into the details it makes some pretty unpleasant reading, absolutely brutal attacks on elderly too often, and way outnumbered 2-4+ guys versus an old farmer or owner and his wife...

This week there was one on a younger couple and their children.
Believe male farmer was brutally beaten with significant head injuries.
And this couple was apparently very security conscious and yet the perpetrators got in.
These do not seem like low level criminals at all.

[apollo11]

Yes, I saw this one, horrific attack.

[Fransw]

The Rand is over 10... The End

[cage]

The Rand is over 10... The End

That would be 2001.
Where the average monthly income was around R4000 and in 2024 it was R28220.

[flysouth]

Hopefully the start of more rolling heads

"If the person appointed as head of the ;police is an ethical person...."

Oh dear me, can one be as naive as this and still breathe on one's own?

[snoopy]

An observation - there is a noticeable increase in young white vagrants in Cape Town this year.

[Whirly]

Now there is a new proposal for a R100b fund to be established to fund, advance and support BEE businesses.

This money will come from the after tax profits of companies, at 3% of that.

What are these people smoking, it will end up as a fund being plundered and will only benefit those in power.

Whirly.