Body Scanners

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Antman
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Re: Body Scanners

Unread post by Antman »

I do hope you will all remember you whit and wisdom the next time a friendly gentleman places an explosive device ondoard your aircraft.
http://mobile.theverge.com/2012/3/8/285 ... an-corbett
Israeli Security Expert to Canada: 'Full Body Scanners Useless'An Israeli security expert tells Canada its full-body scanners are useless. "I can overcome them with enough explosives to bring down a Boeing 747.
By Hana Levi Julian
First Publish: 4/25/2010, 9:59 AM / Last Update: 4/25/2010, 10:05 AM



FAn Israeli security expert told Canadian officials their multi-million-dollar investment in full-body scanners for airports across the country was “useless” and could easily be hoodwinked by terrorists.

Rafi Sela, former chief of security at the Israel Airport Authority, spoke with members of Canada's House of Commons Transport Committee via video hookup from Kfar Vradim last Thursday. He told the lawmakers, who were investigating the state of Canada's aviation safety, that the 44 imaging machines – each costing $250,000 – were a response that was too little and too late.

Sela, who helped design the security system at Ben-Gurion International Airport, has some 30 years' experience in the field. He warned the lawmakers, “You are reacting to incidents instead of being one step ahead of them” when the acquisition of the scanners was announced, days after a Nigerian national tried to blow up a U.S. airliner in December.

“I don't know why everybody is running to buy these expensive and useless machines,” Sela commented. “I can overcome the body scanners with enough explosives to bring down a Boeing 747. That's why we haven't put them in our airport.”

Junior Transport Minister Rob Merrifield contended that the scanners met the country's “stringent requirements,” adding that “full-body scanners are used by dozens of countries around the world and are considered one of the most effective methods of screening.”

The scanners are being used for secondary screening to detect non-metallic threats. A passenger may choose a physical “pat-down” instead, according to the Vancouver Sun; some with specific medical conditions or implants may not be able to pass through the scanner.

University of Ottawa aviation security expert and political scientist Mark Salter also testified, agreeing with Merrifield that the scanners were a “genuine leap forward” and calling them a “much better mouse trap.”

Sela recommended instead that Canada use a “trusted traveller” system that sorted pre-approved, low-risk passengers, who could quickly be moved on with an expedited screening process, from those who might require more investigation. Such investigation would employ enhanced screening areas where automatic sniffing technology could be used to rule out explosives on a person's body or in baggage. He added that Canadians should also be using behavioral profiling.

Israeli security officials routinely use both.


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ARM505
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Re: Body Scanners

Unread post by ARM505 »

Ploughman wrote:I do hope you will all remember you whit and wisdom the next time a friendly gentleman places an explosive device ondoard your aircraft.
I'm commenting regarding the routine scanning of aircrew with full body scanners. Next time I plan to blow up my own aircraft, I give myself....ooooh, let's see - about 100% chance to succeed?
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Re: Body Scanners

Unread post by Ploughman »

ARM505 wrote:
Ploughman wrote:I do hope you will all remember you whit and wisdom the next time a friendly gentleman places an explosive device ondoard your aircraft.
I'm commenting regarding the routine scanning of aircrew with full body scanners. Next time I plan to blow up my own aircraft, I give myself....ooooh, let's see - about 100% chance to succeed?
You will have to get past the Capt/Fo first, or do you have that planned already. I doubt if the scanning is aimed at the flight deck. I am worried about the all-sorts in the back including the freight minders. Now to get past that you have to Scan everybody, including the driver and assistant driver. Yes it will be a pain in the fundamental orifice if you are flying 3 or 4 legs on the same day. Rather a pain in the FO (fundamental orifice not First officer) than no pain ever again.
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Re: Body Scanners

Unread post by nugpot »

Ploughman wrote:I do hope you will all remember you whit and wisdom the next time a friendly gentleman places an explosive device ondoard your aircraft.
They have plenty of opportunity to do that without passing any of the passenger or crew scanners. The aircraft is visited by cleaners, caterers, refuelers, ramp agents, baggage handlers and various other hangers-on, all working for minimum wage and all with buddies manning security checkpoints. Most of the the airport vehicles are driven outside a few times a week to refuel and are not thoroughly searched when they come back to airside.

Security is an invasive joke. The only reason I bear it at all is because making a scene is just not worth my time and my company pays me handsomely to do whatever it takes to get to my aircraft. Imagine being patted down because you beeped when you went through on your way OUT to go home. You don't really want to know all the crazy <<moderated - language>> we see and have to just accept daily ....................
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Re: Body Scanners

Unread post by Ploughman »

When do you sart using Waterkloof? 8-[
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Re: Body Scanners

Unread post by ARM505 »

nugpot wrote:Imagine being patted down because you beeped when you went through on your way OUT to go home.
Ah, F8, how we so love you :)

Seriously, I asked one of them once what would happen if I didn't have my security tag with me on the way OUT - he said I'd have to stay airside. Fail!
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Re: Body Scanners

Unread post by nugpot »

ARM505 wrote:
nugpot wrote:Imagine being patted down because you beeped when you went through on your way OUT to go home.
Ah, F8, how we so love you :)

Seriously, I asked one of them once what would happen if I didn't have my security tag with me on the way OUT - he said I'd have to stay airside. Fail!
:lol: =D>
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Re: Body Scanners

Unread post by skyhawk1 »

I assume ploughman is the lazy reader type... :?:

Firstly, apologies if this post is regarded as "Old News" but I am performing an avcom recon whilst I have a free evening to share my 2 cents.

However, more to the point, the debate of facilitation vs security is in a constant tug-of-war.
Antman may have a point regarding conditioning, certainly not for aircrew but for security personnel themselves. Excuse the generalisation, but, the average South African security personnel does not have a sufficient education or the skills to work in a fish'nchips shop, now we assign them with the important role of airport regulations enforcer and throw a formidable spanner in the works when we regularly rotate their posts. Whilst a few are very competent, the majority cannot comprehend the difference between passenger, crew security and car watch. (After reading this post, I fear this may continue through the ranks to the personnel implementing this scanning strategy) Non-the-less, in order to keep these frequently fluctuating gate-ornaments doing their job correctly, us crew should follow their sops. (Even if they do look at your licence issuing date and subsequently forbid you to continue through security due your licence being expired!?) :lol:
The art of flying involves aiming at the ground and missing!
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Re: Body Scanners

Unread post by Ploughman »

skyhawk1 wrote:I assume ploughman is the lazy reader type... :?:
Be so kind as to enlighten me with regard to your assumption that I am a lazy reader type. [-( [-(
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Re: Body Scanners

Unread post by skyhawk1 »

ARM505 wrote:
Ploughman wrote:I do hope you will all remember you whit and wisdom the next time a friendly gentleman places an explosive device ondoard your aircraft.
I'm commenting regarding the routine scanning of aircrew with full body scanners. Next time I plan to blow up my own aircraft, I give myself....ooooh, let's see - about 100% chance to succeed?
My assumption after reading through the post, was that you referred to the "all sorts in the back", which is rightfully a security threat however the conversation was specifically regarding the scanning of aircrew.

I apolgize if you feel insulted by this remark, the message was more regarding the point of security than to take a dig at you... :wink:
The art of flying involves aiming at the ground and missing!
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Re: Body Scanners

Unread post by Ploughman »

My view is that if you are going to scan the all sorts and the fat ones in uniform in the back, you will have a riot on your hands if you let the driving guys through without scanning. I doubt if any of the driving kind will consider hi-jacking the aircraft, but as the fat uniformed ones in the back are of hipper pigmentation they will not understand this and put up a fight (Riot) [-X [-X
Personally I prefer not to fly as I see the whole security and scanning system in this country as a big joke on par with the government as any of the security personnel will sell out his mother for a few buck. 8-[ 8-[

Regarding the slow reading, over the last 65 years I have learned to cope quit well with my dyslexia. It takes me longer than you to read read the same story and in some types of light reading make no sense what so ever. In spite of this I had a full and successful life and even became a successful Aircraft maintenance technician, flight engineer and and private pilot. Now put that in your pipe and smoke a slow reader. :roll: :roll:

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