The Savage Shock Cub..

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excolonial
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Re: The Savage Shock Cub..

Unread post by excolonial »

Fransw wrote:Nice modern cockpit. One BIG probem though......I'm not in it! :(

images-25.jpegY59s_uqcsRhbgI2JB7Oc_AbcFnPHLBXqs7-P77NE6UBFPSIRc-H4fUVnm6NjVNHFhvfgII2MQRLSl25fODJsVoCX3qjo2IeEpxb-eMnzqHsTKWTG4YQ0oI2airsbWypH3IOyGX5H58gLW-jbfZUyEjOYk0RBQVIS398=w470-h313-nc.jpeg
That cockpit looks much taller now, very nicely appointed. too many toys, and the second hand market is stone dead...
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Re: The Savage Shock Cub..

Unread post by Bodumatau »

excolonial wrote:
Flyingfrontiers wrote:Hi Excolonial

Noticed your comments on the headroom in the back seat. Which variant did you sit in? Was it one of the new Shock Cubs, or the older Savages, such as the Classic or Cub? The Shock Cub now has a much enlarged cockpit and fuselage, with a whole lot more headroom than the original Savages. So perhaps if you have not sat in the Shock Cub, you would be pleasantly surprised at the space offered, compared to the even SuperCubs. And much easier to climb in and out of too.

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Interesting stuff Craig, and very good news for us taller types. I sat in the bobber( I think) at friedrichshafen, and the Savage cub. Very comfortable and well laid out, but yes headroom was a problem.

Looks a fine machine.

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Hi Excolonial, dunno how tall you are, I am 191cm (6'3"), .....but most of my height is in my torso, I have a seated height of 101cm, so my legs are the same as most guys around 6' and my torso is another 3-4 inches longer than most. so I ALWAYS have a problem sitting in light aircraft. when I sat in the front of the prototype shock cub I was fine except for the flap handle that touched my shoulder, but this the designer acknowledged as an error and the next model has the flap handle moved into a better place. the back seat my head just touched when I sat really upright, but they were happy to adjust that part of the fuselage for me by 2" up so I could fit in. I think wrapping/padding the bars above your head is a must if you doing hard work with any of the cubs that have stiffeners overhead. the shock definitely has more space than the older savage cub/cub-s as I have sat in those

I visited the factory in Italy, the team came across very professional and very busy but the owner/designer still took almost 6 hours to go through every little detail with me (and I can be painfully pedantic).
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Re: The Savage Shock Cub..

Unread post by excolonial »

Bodumatau wrote:
Hi Excolonial, dunno how tall you are, I am 191cm (6'3"), .....but most of my height is in my torso, I have a seated height of 101cm, so my legs are the same as most guys around 6' and my torso is another 3-4 inches longer than most. so I ALWAYS have a problem sitting in light aircraft. when I sat in the front of the prototype shock cub I was fine except for the flap handle that touched my shoulder, but this the designer acknowledged as an error and the next model has the flap handle moved into a better place. the back seat my head just touched when I sat really upright, but they were happy to adjust that part of the fuselage for me by 2" up so I could fit in. I think wrapping/padding the bars above your head is a must if you doing hard work with any of the cubs that have stiffeners overhead. the shock definitely has more space than the older savage cub/cub-s as I have sat in those

I visited the factory in Italy, the team came across very professional and very busy but the owner/designer still took almost 6 hours to go through every little detail with me (and I can be painfully pedantic).
Hi Bodumatau, I am 6'4" and I think equally long in body and leg, so I suspect our heads would be roughly at the same spot. They are very nicely made machines, and they have really made an effort with the deisgn flair as well. Its good to hear that you were well looked after at the factory - indicative of an open mindset. I have smacked my head on the overhead stiffeners of a cub derivative beofre. Not fun...

I met the guy who makes the CH7 and CH77 helicopters. He was abrupt, patronising and not interested in making much of an effort. Would probably still buy one if they were a little more reasonably priced.
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Re: The Savage Shock Cub..

Unread post by Fransw »

Maybe we must start a new thread on the subject of "safe GA aircraft"..

When one look at the accidents the last couple of weeks all pilots could have benefited by a slower landing/Crash speed. Most hit the earth at a speed in excess of 45mph-70mph. I'm no specialist and only speculating..

If they have flown a different recreational aircraft and crashed at a speed of ±25mph like this Shock Cub, the injuries to pilot and pax would have been much less!?

Maybe when choosing a recreational/Training aircraft we must start at the crash scene?.. I stand to be corrected on above! :)
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Re: The Savage Shock Cub..

Unread post by pilotC »

Fransw wrote:Maybe we must start a new thread on the subject of "safe GA aircraft"..

When one look at the accidents the last couple of weeks all pilots could have benefited by a slower landing/Crash speed. Most hit the earth at a speed in excess of 45mph-70mph. I'm no specialist and only speculating..

If they have flown a different recreational aircraft and crashed at a speed of ±25mph like this Shock Cub, the injuries to pilot and pax would have been much less!?

Maybe when choosing a recreational/Training aircraft we must start at the crash scene?.. I stand to be corrected on above! :)
I would be very interested in reading a topic like this.
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Re: The Savage Shock Cub..

Unread post by Bodumatau »

Fransw wrote:Maybe we must start a new thread on the subject of "safe GA aircraft"..

When one look at the accidents the last couple of weeks all pilots could have benefited by a slower landing/Crash speed. Most hit the earth at a speed in excess of 45mph-70mph. I'm no specialist and only speculating..

If they have flown a different recreational aircraft and crashed at a speed of ±25mph like this Shock Cub, the injuries to pilot and pax would have been much less!?

Maybe when choosing a recreational/Training aircraft we must start at the crash scene?.. I stand to be corrected on above! :)
Fransw, I don't think any aircraft (or anything that flies for that matter) is completely idiot proof, even with these super STOL machines, if you push it over the edge and drop a wing at 30ft AGL you are GOING TO GET HURT.....the bobby breedans of this world don't land in 15ft without their own fair share of spills, I am sure he has paid his school fees.
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Re: The Savage Shock Cub..

Unread post by pilotC »

But it sure does give you options. You dont have to fly at 15 knots.
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Re: The Savage Shock Cub..

Unread post by Fransw »

Bodumatau wrote:
Fransw wrote:Maybe we must start a new thread on the subject of "safe GA aircraft"..

When one look at the accidents the last couple of weeks all pilots could have benefited by a slower landing/Crash speed. Most hit the earth at a speed in excess of 45mph-70mph. I'm no specialist and only speculating..

If they have flown a different recreational aircraft and crashed at a speed of ±25mph like this Shock Cub, the injuries to pilot and pax would have been much less!?

Maybe when choosing a recreational/Training aircraft we must start at the crash scene?.. I stand to be corrected on above! :)
Fransw, I don't think any aircraft (or anything that flies for that matter) is completely idiot proof, even with these super STOL machines, if you push it over the edge and drop a wing at 30ft AGL you are GOING TO GET HURT.....the bobby breedans of this world don't land in 15ft without their own fair share of spills, I am sure he has paid his school fees.

Bodumatau, I agree no aircraft is idiot proof..

Example: say 2 responsible pilots with the same training on type, etc one in a Sling/RV for example and one in a Cub type aircraft is having engine failure at 1000agl. Which one will survive the most likely?
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Re: The Savage Shock Cub..

Unread post by HASELL »

By responsible pilots I presume you also imply sufficiently competent to fly the Sling/RV in the one and the Cub-type STOL in the other... the STOL machine, hand over fist.
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Re: The Savage Shock Cub..

Unread post by HASELL »

...and let me qualify why I say so. I have about 200 hours on Cirrus, and about 80 on Maule, and the Maule, held in a fully developed stall with full flaps will mush at 500ft/min and 20kts indicated. A Cirrus on the chute descends at more than 1000ft/min.
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Re: The Savage Shock Cub..

Unread post by Fransw »

Yes, I think the Cub/Maule/Safari type aircraft are safer aeries than Rv/Sling type..

Its better to crash at 20kts than 45kts+... Now for the hate mail! :oops:
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Re: The Savage Shock Cub..

Unread post by apollo11 »

A little bit of a quandary, the Sling will certainly glide further than the Cub, so the Sling could glide to a better area and the Cub could put down in a worse rougher boulder and ravine strewn area...

A J3 for example is very safe it can just barely kill you.
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Re: The Savage Shock Cub..

Unread post by jimdavis »

Not sure that these generalisations are valid. Yes, slow is definitely better. But having the wings above you is not a good idea if you come down hard. And aeroplanes often tend to wind up the right way up - with the wings at the bottom after a whoopsie :shock: :D

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Re: The Savage Shock Cub..

Unread post by Bodumatau »

and flying a Piper Meridian at FL280 is even safer cause you can glide 91km and "almost always" find a farm strip to land on..... 8) (pls nobody shoot me down I have thumbsucked a 12:1 glide ratio,... hope that Piper Meridians can get to FL280 and left a few thousand feet for the hot circuit)

I think we cannot generalise like this, if stalls is what worries a pilot they aren't going to solve the problem by buying an aircraft that "doesn't stall", cause every aircraft stalls at some point. troll youtube for supercub landings gone wrong and they mostly do one thing, drop a wing and cartwheel in, this is because they have stalled one and torque rolled in to the ground.

rather take someone competent with you to the GA, go up to a safe altitude and fly your ship on the stall for an hour, I promise you after that you will have a completely different outlook on the limits of your plane, even better is to switch your warning horn off after you are comfortable so you learn to listen to your airframe and feel your plane and not only rely on the blaring horn............
and because this is an open forum I am going to repeat the obvious facts :shock:
1. make sure you have someone with you who is competent at dealing with the consequences of a badly recovered stall (spin, inverted spin, spiral dive)
2. make sure your aircraft behaves in the stall before trying this (read your POH)

every aircraft is only as safe as its mission parameters define, you push any of those limits, either too slow or too fast and you are going to get into trouble.
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Re: The Savage Shock Cub..

Unread post by Fransw »

I agree Bodumatau, its all in the training and practice, and then some more training!.. :D

Look at this Italian Stallion! 8)
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