Your Opinion: The T&Cs of AvCom

[HJK 414]

What about having some sort of mentorship system?
............
There has to be some form of moderation in the academy I believe. Otherwise all the absolutely invaluable nuggets that are posted there, are completely lost in a sea of one line attempts at humour, from people who have nothing valuable to add but feel the need to chime in just to up their post count, or show their presence.

Burner



Nailed it - previous posts show exactly what I mean .....
All I am trying to do is interact with peers / past or present and discuss aviation - without the very helpful comments by the Chuck's of this world

JK

[Fransw]

What about having some sort of mentorship system?
............
There has to be some form of moderation in the academy I believe. Otherwise all the absolutely invaluable nuggets that are posted there, are completely lost in a sea of one line attempts at humour, from people who have nothing valuable to add but feel the need to chime in just to up their post count, or show their presence.

Burner



Nailed it - previous posts show exactly what I mean .....
All I am trying to do is interact with peers / past or present and discuss aviation - without the very helpful comments by the Chuck's of this world

JK

Now please go start your own ''club'' Thanks!

[jimdavis]

What about having some sort of mentorship system? Whereby contributors experienced in their particular sector of the industry identify themselves (with or without their real names, as some company's have strict social media policies), but have a more detailed bio section. I.e. Joe Soap, years in aviation: XXX years, sector of the industry: fixed wing/rotary/gliding/flight training/airline. etc etc. It's a bit like the Facebook group expert system, where new posters can immediately discern between the peanut gallery, and the those posting decent advise?

These people could be some how identified as ''mentors''. Make this something exclusive to the Academy and similar sections of the board. Make it voluntary of course, but how it would be decided who's a mentor and who isn't i'm not sure.

There has to be some form of moderation in the academy I believe. Otherwise all the absolutely invaluable nuggets that are posted there, are completely lost in a sea of one line attempts at humour, from people who have nothing valuable to add but feel the need to chime in just to up their post count, or show their presence.

Ah ha - perhaps we are making progress. There could be sub sections of academy - academy/gliding; academy/bush-flyinig; academy/yarns; academy/training; academy/flight safety; academy/engineering; academy/accidents; academy/history; academy/biz-jets, and so on - each with its own 'mentor'.

Actually no, on second thought's that would be a hell of a lot of work and would not solve the two problems of killer-mods and no name brand bull-sitters.

Actually, Roger, I don't think your argument against people coming clean about who they are, holds much water. You correctly claim that they can lie about who they are - but so can anyone you meet in the street or in a pub or club. They will eventually be found out - and even if nine out of ten come clean about where they are based, what they do, their age, their backgrounds and and interests, it would make a world of difference.

And it's not a big deal. People who want to enter the hallowed gates of academy will need to supply those basic details - just once. If they want to lie then so be it. It will come back to bite them in the bum soon enough.

In the same way that I can't take no-name brands seriously - I am even more reluctant to be modded by them. That's my bottom line

This doesn't require tweaks and excuses, Roger. What you are doing now is not working. it calls for bold steps and a firm hand on the tiller.

Until then I will pop in occasionally and see if anything has changed.

jim

[HJK 414]

.............where new posters can immediately discern between the peanut gallery, and the those posting decent advise?

These people could be some how identified as ''mentors''. Make this something exclusive to the Academy and similar sections of the board. Make it voluntary of course, but how it would be decided who's a mentor and who isn't i'm not sure.

................are completely lost in a sea of one line attempts at humour, from people who have nothing valuable to add but feel the need to chime in just to up their post count, or show their presence.

Burner

I agree completely - we somehow have to get a division between aviation related people and the peanut gallery ...

I have no idea how to do it - but the past few posts illustrate exactly what I meant - and why I quit ..

Someone could try to explain to Chuck that it is an aviation forum - and telling experienced (ex) pilots to bugger off / in order to leave the Wikipilots and Googlechucks to determine what is relevant - is a tad out of the ordinary .. ??

JK

[HJK 414]

..............
This doesn't require tweaks and excuses, Roger. What you are doing now is not working. it calls for bold steps and a firm hand on the tiller.

Until then I will pop in occasionally and see if anything has changed.

jim

Jim,

Agree,
Way too many bull sitters here - and we need to either clean up - or clear out.
No more BS about hiding posts - or ignoring "Chuck" - a return to a decent aviation forum please .

JK

[Burner]

What about having some sort of mentorship system? Whereby contributors experienced in their particular sector of the industry identify themselves (with or without their real names, as some company's have strict social media policies), but have a more detailed bio section. I.e. Joe Soap, years in aviation: XXX years, sector of the industry: fixed wing/rotary/gliding/flight training/airline. etc etc. It's a bit like the Facebook group expert system, where new posters can immediately discern between the peanut gallery, and the those posting decent advise?

These people could be some how identified as ''mentors''. Make this something exclusive to the Academy and similar sections of the board. Make it voluntary of course, but how it would be decided who's a mentor and who isn't i'm not sure.

There has to be some form of moderation in the academy I believe. Otherwise all the absolutely invaluable nuggets that are posted there, are completely lost in a sea of one line attempts at humour, from people who have nothing valuable to add but feel the need to chime in just to up their post count, or show their presence.

Ah ha - perhaps we are making progress. There could be sub sections of academy - academy/gliding; academy/bush-flyinig; academy/yarns; academy/training; academy/flight safety; academy/engineering; academy/accidents; academy/history; academy/biz-jets, and so on - each with its own 'mentor'.

I don't think you need subsections, which would definitely make a mess. I just think there needs to be some clear way, especially for newer members who arrive and ask legitimate questions, who is actually answering. Is it someone who actually knows what they are talking about, or is it someone just chiming in from the sidelines. The major issue on the forum is the anonymity, as I believe a lot of people would think a little bit more before posting should they have their real name behind the post. Unfortunately for a variety of reasons, like employer policies and privacy reasons people can't be forced into doing that. FlyAfrica on Facebook for example, seems to be a lot more civil more often than not, because people are posting using their own names. Actually I've found that the Facebook groups setup with ''experts'', ''top contributor'' tags on certain members a brilliant way to quickly understand in any group, who's advise to focus on.

[Argonaught]

Perhaps a suggestion that would benefit everyone:

Have a new section - Call it 'the Pub'
Similar to how we have a split between non members and members - have it as the third split.

To be a part of this 'pub' you have to:
- Prove you are a pilot/ aviation related (mechanic/ atns etc)
- have to pay a small yearly fee to participate in this pub (liken it to paying for a beer at the pub) - This will cover the extra server usage and moderation/ admin needed. Make it ad free if needs be.
- Use your full name, surname etc - Be a 'real' person.

Then only members of the pub can participate (comment, post etc).

If you want, give them a different colour (Green for Mods/ Blue for confirmed aviation industry member).

Change nothing for the free members - all the current sections should still be available for the 'free' members.

That way the Pilots etc get their own section that they want, they get to be seen as 'mentors' etc and the 'free' members don't really notice a difference.

[HJK 414]

.......... I just think there needs to be some clear way, especially for newer members who arrive and ask legitimate questions, who is actually answering. Is it someone who actually knows what they are talking about, or is it someone just chiming in from the sidelines. ........
.........

Burner

Case in point - look back a few posts
How difficult is it to explain what your aviation experience is ?
It's a simple question.

I don't care whether you have flown 1 hour or 10.000 - but at least make known who you are and what you do in aviaton - or whether you just dig being on an aviation site.

Avcom is loosing more and more experienced people / (and Mods) - yet we have the same people from the sidelines telling us to fukc off and start our own club ....

And once again - the Mods do nothing to keep the site / forums "clean"
No gentle tap on the shoulder : "Say mate - this is an aviation forum - perhaps pull your neck in ?? "
That has led to the current status of Avcom ...

Read UD's post - spot on !!

JK

[Burner]

To be a part of this 'pub' you have to:
- Prove you are a pilot/ aviation related (mechanic/ atns etc)
- have to pay a small yearly fee to participate in this pub (liken it to paying for a beer at the pub) - This will cover the extra server usage and moderation/ admin needed.
- Use your full name, surname etc - Be a 'real' person.

The issue here is that there are a quite a few people on this forum with no formal background in aviation, that have been actively following aviation for decades, yet have no formal qualification in aviation. To exclude these people would seem wrong, as many of them add a lot of value to this forum.

To me the main issue is still the Academy, where so many newer folk to aviation come and ask for advice. They would surely feel intimidated if the only way to get a proper, educated/experienced answer to their question was to join something like ''the pub''.

To me it seems a two fold conundrum. Keep the Academy focused and on topic, with minimal chaff on the threads there. Split the banter of those threads onto a separate section of the forum where folk can still joke around and make off the cuff comments. It seems to be me to indeed be a conundrum... because the last thing the forum needs is to be less inclusive.

[Argonaught]

To be a part of this 'pub' you have to:
- Prove you are a pilot/ aviation related (mechanic/ atns etc)
- have to pay a small yearly fee to participate in this pub (liken it to paying for a beer at the pub) - This will cover the extra server usage and moderation/ admin needed.
- Use your full name, surname etc - Be a 'real' person.

To me the main issue is still the Academy, where so many newer folk to aviation come and ask for advice. They would surely feel intimidated if the only way to get a proper, educated/experienced answer to their question was to join something like ''the pub''.

That's why I explicitly say

> Change nothing for the free members - all the current sections should still be available for the 'free' members.

This includes the aviation safety section. The confirmed pilots etc will have blue names so their names will naturally stand out more than a free members one but everyone will still be there.

[Fransw]

.......... I just think there needs to be some clear way, especially for newer members who arrive and ask legitimate questions, who is actually answering. Is it someone who actually knows what they are talking about, or is it someone just chiming in from the sidelines. ........
.........

Burner

Case in point - look back a few posts
How difficult is it to explain what your aviation experience is ?
It's a simple question.

I don't care whether you have flown 1 hour or 10.000 - but at least make known who you are and what you do in aviaton - or whether you just dig being on an aviation site.

Avcom is loosing more and more experienced people / (and Mods) - yet we have the same people from the sidelines telling us to fukc off and start our own club ....

And once again - the Mods do nothing to keep the site / forums "clean"
No gentle tap on the shoulder : "Say mate - this is an aviation forum - perhaps pull your neck in ?? "
That has led to the current status of Avcom ...

Read UD's post - spot on !!

JK

Now you are taking a big fat change Jan or who ever you are(I see you're still hiding?!)

[HJK 414]

Perhaps a suggestion that would benefit everyone:

Have a new section - Call it 'the Pub'
Similar to how we have a split between non members and members - have it as the third split.

To be a part of this 'pub' you have to:
- Prove you are a pilot/ aviation related (mechanic/ atns etc)
- have to pay a small yearly fee to participate in this pub (liken it to paying for a beer at the pub) - This will cover the extra server usage and moderation/ admin needed. Make it ad free if needs be.
- Use your full name, surname etc - Be a 'real' person.

Then only members of the pub can participate (comment, post etc).

If you want, give them a different colour (Green for Mods/ Blue for confirmed aviation industry member).

Change nothing for the free members - all the current sections should still be available for the 'free' members.

That way the Pilots etc get their own section that they want, they get to be seen as 'mentors' etc and the 'free' members don't really notice a difference.

Argo,

That is more or less what I started with - many moons ago / in a request to Roger
He told me he actually did put it to the Mod group - but it was not accepted / agreed that it was a good idea.

But Roger is not very keen on a "closed group" / and his argument holds water.
Avcom was created for Aviation enthusiasts as well - and that is a good thing - as a forum such as this can lead to people wishing to start a flying career and other lower time fliers can learn from the mistakes we made during our careers .....

Yet - somehow the balance has gone the wrong way on Avcom it seems - and in an awkward sort of way - the Mods are now copping the flack ...
I don't think they carry any blame or responsability - it is a matter of "dividing" (as Burner stated) or keeping in check - the peanut gallery somehow.

Difficult one.
But whether Avcom can continue heamorrhaging experienced people is a big question.
It is clearly visible and one wonders where the bottom line is.....

JK

[HJK 414]

Now you are taking a big fat change Jan or who ever you are(I see you're still hiding?!)

Frans,

Embarrassed at being called out ??
stop making a fool of yourself please - it was a simple question.

Most of the members that I feel are relevant (including the mods) know my name - and some have even visited my home (in Germany as well as Spain) over the years... I have never hidden it - nor have I made a sectret of my aviation career.

Are you now appointing yourself as the administrator here ??
Or simply adding to the post count (10.000 in sight !!)

JK

[B.hawker]

Funny enough, I proposed the Acadamy section back in the day.......

The original intent was for experienced members to impart their hard earnd and vital experience on to those with less experience, air time / stick and rudder time.

It was meant to be a place where we could publish lessons learned during a particular day's flying - all in the hope of creating awareness and making a better, safer pilot out of (not only me) but the community as a whole.

It has, over the years done that....but it has also lost a bit of its original direction - not only that.... but there is so much highly valuable content in those pages - some of which is totally lost between the... err....not so great content, that it will take a lifetime to go through it and actually learn.

Hopefully guidelines are found and agreed on to at least save the massive resource of knowledge.....it's most likely up there with the best knowledge base in the World when it comes to gaining a first hand understsanding of what it really takes to be an aviator.

[Fransw]

Now you are taking a big fat change Jan or who ever you are(I see you're still hiding?!)

Frans,

Embarrassed at being called out ??
stop making a fool of yourself please - it was a simple question.

Most of the members that I feel are relevant (including the mods) know my name - and some have even visited my home (in Germany as well as Spain) over the years... I have never hidden it - nor have I made a sectret of my aviation career.

Are you now appointing yourself as the administrator here ??
Or simply adding to the post count (10.000 in sight !!)

JK

Ok, but you are also making a fool of yourself. Why are you still here btw. You threatened us dozens of times that you are leaving but, nothing yet!! Are you back or not?? Yes 10 000. Why are you still hiding!?

I think we have a Big baby on our hands!